How long does it take for a RCS to molt?

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Fri Jul 06, 2007 9:08 pm

I looked briefly, and could only find one thread that even comes close to my question...

I have a female RCS that has been molting for over 2 days now...she started by the upper portion of her exo breaking loose from the tail part. The head part is just bearly loose...little more than, and the tail has not split yet. I see her little legs running under her exo to break it loose, but like I said, it has been over 2 days now. Is she going to die? Is there anything I need to do for her? She is one of my reddest, so I don't want to loose her...I don't want to lose any!...I only have 4 that are REALLY red, and she is one...I have done 30% water changes weekly, and the only thing that has changed it that I have quit adding aquarium salt to the tank (I have Betta fish in different tanks, and change their water at the same time...more out of habit to add salt then anything). Am I doing something wrong now? None have had problems molting until now. I have had them since Feb, and have yet to have babies...I did just have dropped eggs (I have removed the 4week old betta fry, and both the SAE, so it is now a RCS only tank again...only had the fish in there for about 1 1/2 weeks...dropped egg post).

All suggestions are appreciated!

Newjohn · Post by **Newjohn** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:19 am

Hi Suzie Q

The preperation to molt takes longer than the molting itself.

The shrimp will arch its body to loosen the exo skeleton, this takes a little will "never timed it"

And all of a sudden, in a split second, they pop right out of there old skin.

I has never witnessed the problem your shrimp is having.

As to the aquarium salt
It is not needed, so stop adding it with your water changes.

If you had Betta fry in the same tank, what was the PH ?

John

badflash · Post by **badflash** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 4:19 am

Just wait and do nothing. Most of the time this takes care of itself. Normally molting takes no time at all. This is an abnormal molt. Hopefully the rest will come off, and should come off normally at the next molt. Any chemicals suggested may make you feel better, but not the shrimp.

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Sat Jul 07, 2007 7:41 am

Thanks guys...NewJohn...this behavior is a lot like what you described. The salt was more out of habit (I have done 2 water changes w/o salt)...my pH is normal (tap water) around 7.6...I just did a water change yesterday, and my "scheduled" Testing is later today, so I will post the results later.

She (the shrimp) does not look stressed or anything, this is just the first time I have seen the molting process...

and just to let everyone know...the betta fry were in there only to eat the copepods...once those were "under control" again, the fry were removed.

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Sun Jul 08, 2007 6:53 pm

Ok, the parameters...

Amm. 0.0
Nitrite 0.0
Nitrate between 0.0 and 5.0 (closer to 0.0)
pH 7.6 (this is normal for my tap)

gH 179ppm (I don't know if I am reading this right...it took 10 drops to change)
kH 107.4ppm (again, don't know...6 drops to change)...I have the API kH/gH kit if that helps.

As of today, I have 2 good molts, but that same female is still "stuck" in her exo...she is still working on it...again, just a little worried.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 10:12 am

Hi SuzieQ.
Seems like good RC shrimp water to me.

Is it possible you only have females?

Also, I have found that I have my best results when breeding RCS is when there is thick plant growth especially Hornwart seems to give good results followed closely by Najas guadelupensis then Java Moss.

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 11:07 am

apistomaster wrote:Hi SuzieQ.
Seems like good RC shrimp water to me.

Is it possible you only have females?

Also, I have found that I have my best results when breeding RCS is when there is thick plant growth especially Hornwart seems to give good results followed closely by Najas guadelupensis then Java Moss.

I have males...1 is nice looking...lots of red for a male, and 2 others are nice (not as nice, but nice) and then 2 others are very pale, and will be coming out of the breeding colony as soon as I start to have babies (right now, I just want babies)...I have 1 REALLY red female, and like said before, this girl is one of my reddest. I also have Naja (not sure which...if there is more than one kind), and only 1 little sprig of Hornwart lived from my "plant". It is hard to find around here, so I have to drive 3 towns over to find (if they have it in) it. I also have Java Moss and Fern, along with twianan? moss, cabomba, Rotala (not sure varity...it was a ROAK freebee and lace fern.

Here are pictures of her (taken Sat)...she is in hiding now...I can see her in the Naja, but not well...also a picture of the tank they are in.
Tank:

The shrimp:

She has not changed much over the last few days...she seems like she is getting stressed now.

Newjohn · Post by **Newjohn** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:14 pm

Hi Suzie Q

I have never seen a attempted Molt like that, If that is what it is.

Hopefuly someone can tell us what has happened.

Good luck.

John

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:44 pm

Definitely not a normal molt and the underlying tissue does not look like shell. This looks more like an injury of some kind and if so, prognosis is not good.

Great photos but none of the shrimp shown were males. I'm sure color intensity of males varies with the strain and diet but I have brilliant red females like yours but none of my males are more than a transparent light pink. They are smaller and much more slender in build. Perhaps a photo of the males could be posted?

The Najas guadelupensis is the most common species in circulation. Heavy plant density and well developed ecosystems tend to be good producers of shrimp. The specific plant is much less important than the density of the growth and your plants will soon become quite thick. They are already more than sufficient for good production. The females appear to be bearing eggs and I would expect a lot of little ones in there. Something is missing and I still lean to there being a lack of males.
It is hard for me to imagine not having any reproduction in the setting you have provided.

When I bought my very first cherry shrimp it was from an on-line vendor that claims to raise their own but they only sent females whiich did not live long. In retrospect, it is clear they were imported and not raised by the seller. It is possible for this situation to occur when buying from a petshop as well.
I get good production to the point of having to remove excess shrimp where I originally added a few very tiny shrimp to killifish fry tanks. They reach breeding stage early and are successful with only a few bits of plants in bare bottom 4.5 gallon tanks.

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 1:55 pm

I think she may have died...I found this girl eating/fighting over pink cotton candy (well, that is what it looks like...pink flesh)...I wonder if the shrimp could have sustained an injury...if so, how?

Holy Crap! Could SAE caused this? I noticed it a few days (a week?) after I took those 3 out! SAE are not aggressive are they? I got them for algae eaters (had several forums ID them as true SAE and not flying foxes) for my 55g. This girl never lost her color before "trying to molt" like most of them do.

If this was caused my the SAE (s), please note that all FISH have been removed from the tank!

zapisto · Post by **zapisto** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 3:35 pm

did not look like a molt for me also.

apistomaster · Post by **apistomaster** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:30 pm

SuzieQ said
"Holy Crap! Could SAE caused this? I noticed it a few days (a week?) after I took those 3 out! SAE are not aggressive are they? I got them for algae eaters (had several forums ID them as true SAE and not flying foxes) for my 55g. This girl never lost her color before "trying to molt" like most of them do. Sad
If this was caused my the SAE (s), please note that all FISH have been removed from the tank!"

Yes, SuzieQ, SAE can do that. They do not have teeth in their mouths but there are hardened structures that aid in removing algae and it is combined with a strong suction action. They are not exactly aggressive but they do become territorial as they mature . The results are the same. I'm sure one just tried to investigate one of the shrimp and the only way most fish have of doing this is with their mouth.

zapisto · Post by **zapisto** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:55 pm

If this was caused my the SAE (s), please note that all FISH have been removed from the tank!

that's the way i like a shrimp tank

Suzie Q · Post by **Suzie Q** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:36 pm

apistomaster wrote:Great photos but none of the shrimp shown were males. I'm sure color intensity of males varies with the strain and diet but I have brilliant red females like yours but none of my males are more than a transparent light pink. They are smaller and much more slender in build. Perhaps a photo of the males could be posted?

The Najas guadelupensis is the most common species in circulation. Heavy plant density and well developed ecosystems tend to be good producers of shrimp. The specific plant is much less important than the density of the growth and your plants will soon become quite thick. They are already more than sufficient for good production. The females appear to be bearing eggs and I would expect a lot of little ones in there. Something is missing and I still lean to there being a lack of males.
It is hard for me to imagine not having any reproduction in the setting you have provided.

When I bought my very first cherry shrimp it was from an on-line vendor that claims to raise their own but they only sent females whiich did not live long. In retrospect, it is clear they were imported and not raised by the seller. It is possible for this situation to occur when buying from a petshop as well.
I get good production to the point of having to remove excess shrimp where I originally added a few very tiny shrimp to killifish fry tanks. They reach breeding stage early and are successful with only a few bits of plants in bare bottom 4.5 gallon tanks.

I got these from a "friend" that I met online (ok, that did not come out right!)...he helped me set my tank up, and got me up and running, then sent me shrimp free of charge...I felt guilty, and pd shipping (with a little extra)..the first 4 (to see if I could keep them alive) were all girls, then he sent me 10 more...3 boys in that bunch, then I purchased 2 adult female and 2 adult male from him, so I have a total of 5 males and ???? 11 females (I accidentally killed a young female by trapping her under a carefully laid rock...well obvioulsy not carefully enough...she swam under it as I sat it down), and now this girl has gone missing (presumed dead).

None of my female are berried (unless they are microscopic at first)...I have had eggs dropped, and just before that, I witnessed a mating.

Here are pictures of the boys I could find:
Possibly my RED male in left corner (tail)...he/she is in the last photo also...

This male ^ is the same in the background in the picture below:

I thought this was my REALLY red male on the right, but now I am not sure...looks female in the picture:

EDIT:
I have been reading about using Prime in the Shrimp tank...ok, I finally got some, but I have been using the last of AquaSafe by Tetra (yes it has slimecoat stuff in it...bad me)...could THIS be a major reason I don't have babies yet? I asked the guy I got mine from if he uses Prime, and he said he did not (actually never heard of it). I keep Betta Fish at home (in their own tanks), so that is why I have slimecoat conditioner. With the next water change, it will be stricty Prime. Any thoughts?
Thanks guys!

Beast1961 · Post by **Beast1961** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:08 pm

Thanks for the picts Suzie..Wish my camera took such nice pictures, I have a Canon PowerShot A75...It was a hand me down from ma'ma...An Ebay queen.

Well all I can do is wait now till my babies start to grow-up and hopefully become daddies. The good thing is I'll know they came from two different gene pools. I swear I spend 4-6 hours a day just sitting and watching them...That's not counting the maintanance.

Talk to ya soon,
Rick