Can cherry shrimp naturally mutate into crystal red shrimp?

[zwergkrebszuechter]

These things happen, however they are not genetic usually, but a disorder in an early stage of the shrimps development. I personally once had a orange dwarf crayfish with a clear carapace, but an orange tail, a black tiger shrimp, which was only black on one side and a red bee x black bee mixed shrimp, that was red on one side and black (with a recessive red) on the other side.
I reccomend to enjoy it, as long as you have it, it will probably live a normal live, but I doubt that the reason for its color is genetic and that it is possible to seletively breed a strain with this color pattern.

[Neonshrimp]

I reccomend to enjoy it, as long as you have it, it will probably live a normal live, but I doubt that the reason for its color is genetic and that it is possible to seletively breed a strain with this color pattern.

So you think there is most likely environmental factor instead of a genetic one? I ask because you seem to know from the animals you have had experience with.

Thanks.

[mduros]

Here's a couple additional pics I took of her last night. Still haven't moved her into her own digs with some fellas...

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The snail she was riding on is a geriatric spixi that has an acid burned shell from low ph in a different tank.

I'm interested in those environmental factors, too. I agree that I'm probably not going to see this pop up again, or if I do it will be one other one 20 generations down or something. But I feel that it is my responsibility to try.
Take care,
Mary.

[Mustafa]

I agree with zwergkrebszuechter. This looks like some kind of non-genetic defect. I've seen it in other RCS before, but not to such a degree.

[Neonshrimp]

You may want to try and raise some baby/young shrimp in the same environment as this shrimp and see if they show the same characteristic. You can see that she is saddled and will be ready to mate soon

[Shaun]

Could that be a chimira???

[zwergkrebszuechter]

I did not say that the defect is caused by the environment. I do not think so.
Defects like that occur all the time. However most time they result in embryos not able to live. It is just a lucky coincidence, that the defect has affected the pigment cells and not an important inner organ. However there needs to be no genetic reason for it. Just imagine, that the pigment cells are all derived from one cell during the shrimps early development. If this one cell dies by accident the pigment cells that would derive from it are not there. However the shrimp is fully vital, as no important part is missing. That is only one model, that could explain the shrimps looks. Many others are also possible.

[aberfitch]

could be something like a birthmark. only affecting her.

[mduros]

I still haven't separated her and some males. However, I think she may be berried now and while doing waterchanges yesterday it appears that there are others with odd coloration but more mottled opposed to having a defined stripe, as other's have described seeing on occasion. Thanks for all of your input on this.
Take care,
Mary.

[Neonshrimp]

You have something going on there. You might just want to let this tank play itself out and see what other "odd coloration" you get. After a while you can decide what you are interested in and then try to selective breed those. Please try to get some pictures of the other odd colored shrimp and keep us updated, thanks

[mduros]

Okay, I threw a bunch of algae wafers into the tank last night to draw as many shrimp out as I could. You can see the perfectly striped girl towards the upper left hand corner. I have drawn arrows towards three others with odd coloring. Could this be associated with molting instead of being the pattern of the shrimp? I have never noticed it before if it is a normal thing. You guys are the experts, you tell me... Also other info on this tank, I do weekly 50% water changes, my tap water is 7.6 ph and my only tank without inverts is a very stable 7.4 ph. My two tanks with inverts fall from 7.2 after a water change to the low 6s before a water change. I dose those tanks with Kent's Liquid Calcium to try to keep the inverts from leaching the kh too badly. I tested the water in this tank this morning and the ph is 6.4 and the kh is 2. Water change is not until Sunday. The gh did not come out right for some reason so I gave up. I am now wondering if the low ph and kh has a hand in this. I had no idea that this tank was that low. I have a geriatric spixi in there to recover from acid burn from the other tank that is low ph. And now the parameters in this tank is as bad as in the other. Too many inverts...



Take care,
Mary.

[Shaun]

Those look like breaks in the shell to me, I had one die from that. Check this out viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2605&hilit=died+shell
Those aren't my pictures but that is exactly what happened to one of mine.

[mduros]

Interesting link. Thanks. There's no breaks though. You can't tell in the picture but it's clear shiny shell like the first picture I posted of the striped girl. Perhaps the shell is thin though? It wouldn't surprise me if the water is not hard enough. I'll keep on trying to get good pictures.

[Neonshrimp]

I would not try to do anything to correct the water chenistry at this point as the shrimp seem healthy, active and feeding. RCS are hardy and can do well in most water conditions so the color morph may be due to loss of pigments and not a molting problem. Is this just a recent trait you have found or could this have been going on for a while and you just did not notice because you have a ton of shrimp ? Keep watching and post updates when you can, thanks for sharing

[mduros]

Neon,
I'll answer your questions and then try to patiently wait and observe for awhile. It is definitely a new thing that has happened. As I've said, I've had this colony of cherries for a couple of years. I haven't added any. I have a bunch that live in one of my 55 gallon community aquariums. Now it's possible that some of the oddities have sprung up in there, too, but are picked off through natural selection due to the fish that will eat them and that is why I'm only seeing these popping up now in my shrimp/fry grow out tank. This is a tank that I keep my base shrimp colony going in. I like to share the joy of these animals with others. And have done so. People that I have given shrimp to tell me that mine are extremely hardy, spawn like crazy and have really good color. And I also use the tank for pleco, rainbowfish and tetra fry that I am lucky enough to salvage from the main tanks. In fact I have raised two groups of praecox rainbowfish fry in the past 6 months and have been keeping an eagle eye on this tank for at least six months. I would have definitely noticed the color variations pop up sooner had they been there. My females typically show good color from when they are very young through adulthood. I.e. my females get very, very red. The males usually don't have much color but are typically considerably smaller than the ladies. Now, in both my community tank and the grow out tank I have one very large male in them. I got a halfway decent picture of one last night, this is in the grow out tank, I had spotted this guy only recently, the one in my community tank is not quite as white and has been there at least a year. I wish I could have gotten a picture of him beside an adult female for comparison.



It will also be interesting to see if the ladies retain their markings when they are fully mature...???

Take care,
Mary.