halocaridina Ruba Ammonia/ Light

merlin03 · Post by **merlin03** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:47 am

I am keeping Halocaridina on a newly establish tank. Nitrates and nitrites are very close to zero. Ammonia is constantly elevated but on the "safe " side. I dont want to introduce plants to the tank. Can I use zeolite on a filter bag directly into the tank? (using sponge filter). Or just wait as long as the ammonia levels dont increase? How much light should I give them? is this a factor?
Sorry for that many question I just want to provide them with the best environment that I can.

Jojoyojimbi · Post by **Jojoyojimbi** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:10 am

depending on your salinity java fern should survive until the bacteria get more established

merlin03 · Post by **merlin03** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:47 am

salinity is 16ppt. will it survive? thanks for helping.

Jojoyojimbi · Post by **Jojoyojimbi** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:32 am

merlin03 wrote:salinity is 16ppt. will it survive? thanks for helping.

for awhile, it'll have a much slower growth rate than normal, once you get the ammonia under control you can remove the java fern and the bacteria in the substrate, walls, and filter will take over biological filtration

Post by **Mustafa** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:21 am

merlin03 wrote:salinity is 16ppt. will it survive? thanks for helping.

No freshwater plant will survive and *grow* at those salinity levels, no matter what people tell you. Forget about having plants in a H. rubra tank. Algae are a much better solution. I have a type of string algae (that I collected from highly brackish water) that grows very fast in a ball/wad and keeps my water quality where it should be.

The real question here is: Why did you not cycle the tank before introducing the H. rubra?

merlin03 · Post by **merlin03** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 12:49 pm

Mustafa that was my mistake. I am new to this hobby and I thought the tank was cicled. I want to do everything in my power to fix my error.

Is there a way that I can get some of that algae? Thankyou for your response.

Shrimp&Snails · Post by **Shrimp&Snails** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:06 pm

If you want the tank to cycle faster you will need some "used" filter sponge from an established tank. When you get it put it in your filter asap so the good bio bugs don't die.

badflash · Post by **badflash** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:40 pm

I'm running an experiment with anacharis right now at SG 1.018. I'll keep the group posted. Other things I never would have thought could thrive in salt water are doing just fine too, like the MTS and Olive Nerite snails, so never say never. On another board I was subjected to accusations of snail cruelty when I explained what I was doing, so keep an open mind.

I live near the Hudson River where the water goes from fresh to salt on a daily basis, yet fish, snails and plants all live there. I can't say they will all live in an aquarium, but they do exist in nature.

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 7:05 pm

Interesting, thanks for sharing your findings with us. I think that the animals you spoke about in the Hudson River have adapted to their surroundings or even mutated

. Best wishes on your results and keep us posted.

Post by **Mustafa** » Wed Jul 19, 2006 8:19 pm

badflash wrote:Other things I never would have thought could thrive in salt water are doing just fine too, like the MTS and Olive Nerite snails

Remember that I told you about how to acclimate the MTS to saltwater. I only told you that because 1. I researched the issue and found out that MTS occur naturally in brackish to fully marine waters 2. I actually tried it and had offsrping of MTS in a marine tank.

Olive nerites (and also virgin nerites) are known to science as animals that can live at various salinities ranging from freshwater to hypersaline (more salty than marine) conditions. So, no surprise there either.

With regards to plants, I have researched the issue and the conclusion is that even "brackish tolerant" freshwater plants like java moss, java fern etc. die at salinities over about 1.005 SG. I have tried it and can confirm this. Some plants will stay green and take forever to die at the lower end of their lethal salinity range, but they are not growing and hence are useless as "filters."

so never say never.

Ok, I won't say "never." I'll just say "NO WAY" your anacharis is going to survive at that salinity.

The issue is simple, has been researched and tried before. You need something like a miracle for anacharis to survive at 1.018 SG salinity.

On another board I was subjected to accusations of snail cruelty when I explained what I was doing, so keep an open mind.

That's because those people had no idea what they were talking about.

Before I started telling people (mostly you actually and maybe a few other people, plus a post I made on this board) about MTS living and breeding in marine tanks people in the aquarium hobby had no idea about it. I remember you were quite surprised, too. Well, at least the people on that other board are learning now thanks to you proving them wrong with your successful acclimation experiment.

I live near the Hudson River where the water goes from fresh to salt on a daily basis, yet fish, snails and plants all live there. I can't say they will all live in an aquarium, but they do exist in nature.

Yeah, but up where you are the salinity won't go up to 1.018 SG. It can get brackish up there, but on the lower end of the brackish scale. Plus, the life in the Hudson river delta area is adapted to salinity changes. You won't see "pure" freshwater animals there. Here in Manhattan, where the salinity of the hudson river is much higher, you won't be seeing any plants at all, nor any pure freshwater animals, just like you would not see a neon tetra in the amazon delta.

badflash · Post by **badflash** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 5:08 am

Yeah, but up where you are the salinity won't go up to 1.018 SG.

At the surface, no, but deeper down it can get quite strong depending on how much rain water we get. The salt actually forms a wedge and the lower down you go the closer to sea water it gets.

I'm seeing new growth on the anacharis and there is no yellowing yet. You are batting 1000 with the other issues, but I like to check for myself anyway.

Post by **Mustafa** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:13 am

merlin03 wrote:Is there a way that I can get some of that algae? Thankyou for your response.

I'll start distributing it once I start selling the H. rubra. Right now I only have enough of it for myself.

Post by **Mustafa** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 7:16 am

badflash wrote: I'm seeing new growth on the anacharis and there is no yellowing yet. You are batting 1000 with the other issues, but I like to check for myself anyway.

That's a good attitude.

Always double-check information. Although I doubt it, if you are successful with the anacharis and I can duplicate your success, I'd be the first one to report about it here, as it would be great to have an additional plant (beyond my string algae) that could be used in H. rubra tanks.

skewlboy · Post by **skewlboy** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 11:59 am

Why not pick up some macroalgae from a LFS? They usually sell it for refugium in salt tanks. Should work well in that level of salinity as well.

dhavoc · Post by **dhavoc** » Thu Jul 20, 2006 1:33 pm

never thought of trying macro algae for reef tanks, might give it a try. been using java fern in mine (more for aesthetics) and it neither grows nor dies (been months now). my salinity is lower though at 1.010-012 (shrimp are breeding and surviving) and the only algae is the standard brown coating that grows on the glass (shrimp eat it so i leave 3 sides covered in it) and a fuzzy one that looks like little velvet pincusions, this one comes in either a light lime green or a dark emerald green and grows all over the rock exposed to the light. never merges so they stay in little bushes (for lack of a better description).