Hawaiian Reds

[Acsuth]

Hey,
I'm getting some Hawaiian reds in next week. I've got a 3 gallon set-up for them(8 shrimp). Any advice as to how much salt per gallon I should add would be greatly appreciated -- I don't want to shock them with pure freshwater.
I've read the information about them on this site under shrimp varieties -- but would love to know any other tips people have gleaned from experience.

thanks so much,

Amanda

[Mustafa]

Get yourself a hydrometer and add enough salt until you get a specific gravity reading of 1.010-1.012. Done. Make sure you use a ocean water salt formula (not just table salt). When you get the shrimp you can adjust them to the salinity in your tank by mixing the bag water with the tank water and slowly increasing the tank water amount.

From your question I can tell that you did not even cycle your tank. The tank should be cycle with the saltwater in it already. This shrimp species can take a lot of abuse, by why abuse them unnecessarily? Why order shrimp *before* having a cycled salt water tank ready?

[51Cornell]

You'll also need appropriate food for them. From what I can gather (which is pretty minimal), they are vegetarians and will need marine algae to eat (they may be eating microscopic lifeforms too when they sit around picking at stuff, I don't know, they won't share with me). In our tank we've got live sand and a tufa rock that the shrimp love congregating on. I didn't want to put too much more in there since I can't find very much info about whether they prefer bare spaces or planted spaces or woody-rocky-weedy places. They live in rivers so are used to a certain amount of water movement. I'm waiting for Mustafa to write more about what he's found out about these little guys. Some of mine have egg patches under their shells but none of them are carrying eggs and I've been wondering what their breeding trigger is. I may have to take a trip to Hawaii to research them in their natural environment....

[scrimp]

Can regular fresh water spieces eat marine algae? And does salt harm the other shrimp if you house them with other spieces?

[Acsuth]

This shrimp species can take a lot of abuse, by why abuse them unnecessarily? Why order shrimp *before* having a cycled salt water tank ready?

First of all, the tank has been cycling for about two weeks already and it will be almost three weeks by the time my shrimp arrive. Secondly, I used a sponge filter from an established tank and I've got a large clump of java moss and a couple of java ferns planted. I've used soil mixed with coral sand covered with pea size gravel as a substrate. I'm not looking to create a full marine tank -- I've kept certain brackish species before and that's what I'm aiming for. There is already about 1/2 tsp of aquarium salt in the water plus calcium and iodine...I certainly wouldn't be using table salt. lol
Will they eat spirulina? If they need full marine conditions why are they being sold as freshwater/brackish? Will they not survive in an ordinary brackish tank?

thanks for the help,

Amanda

[51Cornell]

What level gravity qualifies as brackish? 1.010 salinity seems fairly light-weight. I know they always say these shrimp can live in freshwater but the one time we tried to keep some in freshwater, they all died within a week or two--but maybe you have to REALLY REALLY SLOWLY acclimate them to freshwater. I'm trying to imagine what life must be like in Hawaiian rivers with the ocean tide backwashing up the river then washing back out, rain water adding freshwater to the rivers diluting whatever salt is in it at the time. I've got my small crew of Hawaiians in 1.010 salinity and they have been doing well (although no breeding has gone on yet--perhaps that happens in full saltwater? Or maybe in full freshwater? Hopefully, someone will find the answer and let us know).

Spiralina is a marine algae (and you can even buy specifically Hawaiian grown spiralina powder too), and fish food manufacturers use it in a lot of veggie-type fish foods for both marine and fw fish. I kind of wonder if the Hawaiians need the marine bacteria too to survive--mine seem to be eating all the time, picking up at stuff I cannot see and it may not be just pieces of algae. Don't those biosphere torture chambers they sell purport that the shrimp eat the algae and bacteria?

[Mustafa]

H. rubra does *not* live in rivers. It lives in anchialine ponds (as my species description already says). If you want to know what an anchialine pond is, look it up in google.

Anything that is saltier than 1.000 specific gravity is already brackish water. Hence, above that level it's just a distinction between more brackish and less brackish.

And no, these shrimp do *not* breed in full strength sea water either. Mine have not produced any young yet and they are in full strength ocean water. These shrimp live in underground waterways part of the time where they might be doing their breeding in nature, so that might be the trick. I will have to experiment a little with providing dark crevices and caves for them and also altering the salinity level.

[Acsuth]

I also wanted to add that I hope I haven't upset you. I think you should be upset with the people selling them as freshwater species, rather than the invert-addicted hobbyist that wants to add some more amazing creatures to her collection. I haven't found much information about them on-line sadly -- if you have any more links to pages that explain them I would love to read even more. I understand how frustrating it is to see the same abuse happening over and over again...I would also like to end their cycle of abuse -- another reason why I posted here, I would wait to get them now, but the seller has very few that may be gone before next week. Just advise me how I can best work with what I have on hand(time restraints etc.) to give them the best possible acclimation. I can get anything I need at the petstore tomorrow...I already have the freshwater tank...if that's bad, I can start from scratch -- I know it won't be able to be properly cycled, but I can still use the old filter and I can do small water changes every day -- plus they will be the only creatures living there. Just let me know what I should do for them.

thanks!

Amanda

[scrimp]

H. rubra does *not* live in rivers. It lives in anchialine ponds (as my species description already says). If you want to know what an anchialine pond is, look it up in google.

Anything that is saltier than 1.000 specific gravity is already brackish water. Hence, above that level it's just a distinction between more brackish and less brackish.

And no, these shrimp do *not* breed in full strength sea water either. Mine have not produced any young yet and they are in full strength ocean water. These shrimp live in underground waterways part of the time where they might be doing their breeding in nature, so that might be the trick. I will have to experiment a little with providing dark crevices and caves for them and also altering the salinity level.

I wonder what the main food source is in the ponds and caves for the shrimp. That might be where the breeding lyes along with the seasons and light periods for these shrimp along with water temp. This sounds like a challenge I would like to take on. Ill have to try and contact some universities in hawaii and see what they have to say on this subject.

[Acsuth]

Ok! Damage control has begun! I've got the instant ocean...I've got the hydrometer...I've got a nice piece of porous rock and some coral sand for substrate. I spent about three hours last night researching true 'brackish' tanks....I feel pretty dumb now lol I thought the setup I used to have for my mollies where I added quite a bit of 'aquarium salt' would be considered 'brackish'....I never knew there was so much to it. I also bought some green marine algae -- they also had a purple kind, will the hawaiian shrimp eat both kinds?
Also, this may be a stupid question, but here goes: how do I get living stuff to start growing on my rock?


Amanda

[thgng]

I'm have been trying to get my hand on these Hawaiian shrimps (Opae-ula ).
Unfortuntely, this company in Hawaii don't ship to my country due to the export permit.

Try this Hawaiian website, they have an article on breeding them:


If anyone know where I can get them, do let me know.

[Acsuth]

Thanks for the link!

[Acsuth]

Thanks again for giving me the fukubonsai link, thgng, I have now ordered their powdered spirulina with measuring scoop and their care manual. I set up a new tank with salinity just over 1 now, I have also asked the guy I'm buying them from what salinity they are in right now. When I hear back from him, I will adjust accordingly.
Just a thought...I used "cycle" brand liquid in the tank...will this be insuficient with the salted water? Do I need to find a product specifically for adding good bacteria to marine tanks?

[scrimp]

I wonder why they call them micro lobsters....Ill have to try this breeding.

[Acsuth]

Ok! I ditched the shelf rock for some actual live rock -- got a little bit of live sand in there too now....I've got a flourescent light for the tank which I keep on about 10-12 hours each day. The hydrometer measures 1.012...I'm a bit nervous however -- one of the pieces of live rock had a wormy thing crawl out of it as soon as I put the piece of rock in the tank...then it died -- in less than a minute Perhaps the worm needed pure seawater?
I contacted David who sells the 'microlobsters' on that site...get this...he won't sell me any of his specially formulated food OR his care guide! How do you like that? Well, he wrote me once and politely told me that I shouldn't concentrate on food for them....I guess that was his final answer...I really think he should have at least sold me his care guide.

Anyway, I have e-mailed the seller of the Hawaiian reds twice already now since I sent payment, asking about what he feeds him and the water parameters -- but he hasn't responded back! Poor little guys, I hope what I've got will be ok for them...I had no clue how complicated this was going to be.