Hi I’m new, with water filter questions

[nick11380]

Hi, this is my first post. I’ve been keeping aquarium fish for around 30 years. Now I recently started keeping “water bugs”, I mean shrimp. I hope I didn’t offend, or get off on the wrong foot by calling our pet shrimp water bugs. But I couldn’t resist, I’ll tell you why. Up until a few weeks ago I never gave our pet shrimp or any shrimp a second thought. I am also not someone who likes to eat shrimp. So sometimes when I go out to eat with friends they like to order shrimp and talk about how yummy it is. So I like to tell them that their eating water bugs. Because they kind of are, but they just look at me like I’m nuts or something.

Anyway I first thought about getting some shrimp about a month ago and the whole process has been kind of stressful.

It started when I went to an aquarium society auction on Feb. 25. On a whim I bid on some aquarium plants. I’ve never kept plants so I didn’t know what I was bidding on and didn’t have a place to put them. But it was only plants so not a big deal. While setting up a tank for my plants I got the idea that maybe I should get some shrimp to put in it. About this time a member of a gold fish forum that I’m a member of mentioned that her cherry shrimp colony has been growing and offered some for sale. So I contacted her and bought 12 cherry shrimp.

Before my shrimp arrived I bought an API test kit (because I read that shrimp are more sensitive than fish), tested all my aquariums and discovered that I have a reading of (.5) ammonia coming out of my tap water (my fish never had any problems). I had three aquariums that I considered putting the shrimp in but because of big water changes that I had done one aquarium had a (.25) ammonia reading the other had a (.5) ammonia reading (These were old cycled tanks treated with stress coat after a big water change) and my plant tank that I just set up had (0) ammonia (1) nitrite (40) nitrate.

When my cherry shrimp arrived (on March 13) I couldn’t put them in these aquariums because of the test numbers. (But I did put 2 in the tank with the ammonia reading of (.25) and they lived) So I ended up moving some gold fish out a 10 gallon aquarium with (0) ammonia. I algae scrapped the bottom (my fish tanks are bare bottom) siphoned out the waste and 50% of the water. Added black gravel. Then refilled the tank from my counter top water filter that I use in the kitchen for drinking water. Because I tested it and it removed all the ammonia & chorine in the tap. Treated it with stress coat. Then added shrimp.

Is my counter top water filter safe for shrimp?

My counter top water filter is a five stage filter.

1. Stage (Mechanical filtration)
2. Stage (Oxidation filtration) Mixture of pure zinc and electrolytic copper. Two dissimilar
metals with relative redox potentials which create conditions for spontaneous oxidation.
3. Stage (Mechanical filtration) Stainless steal screens-5 micron pad
4. Stage (adsorption filtration) Steam activated and designed to effectively remove both low and high
molecular weight compounds. S-A 50 mesh GAC.
5. Stage (mechanical filtration) Stainless steal screens- 5 micron pad.

Water test results from my counter top water filter (with API tests):
Ammonia 0, Chorine 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 5, KH 5, Copper (none detected) PH 8.2

In stage two there’s a mixture of pure zinc and electrolytic copper. Will this copper get into the water and hurt the shrimp? Would all the copper get filtered out in stages 3-5?

I also have copper pipes.

Because of the ammonia in the tap I’ve been thinking about getting an R/O filter. Or would the counter top water filter, filter out all the bad stuff?

If my counter top water filter is safe for shrimp would it be good to just use the filtered water without conditioning it? I tested unconditioned counter top water filter water on a fish one time and it lived. While my unconditioned tap water will kill a fish in minutes.

The water change I did with 50% counter top water filter water seems to be Ok. I’ve been using stress coat but after I found this forum and done a lot of reading. I discovered that prime is the conditioner of choice and started doing water changes with aged water treated with prime.

Everybody is still alive and the female that came with eggs had her babies and yesterday one of the females dropped her saddle and is carrying eggs. When you guys said cherry babies were tiny you weren’t kidding. I’ve had lots of fish babies and hatched lots of brine shrimp to feed them. So I thought that I wouldn’t have any problem seeing them. But I was wrong. Anyway I counted 4 baby shrimp. Hopefully there are more that I can’t see.

If my counter top water filter is safe for shrimp would it be ok to use it without adding conditioner? Or use counter top filter water and prime to be safe?

Would the copper in stage 2 of the water filter get into the water?

Finding ammonia in my tap water caused me to be concerned about the health of my cherry shrimp. So I want to make sure I’m doing what I can to make my water safe for them.

Mustafa, this in an excellent forum you have here. I have been doing a lot of reading of old posts. In addition to all the excellent information about our pet shrimp, I have learned more about the aquarium hobby in general and how to do things from reading old posts here, than I have from any other source.
Any questions I have about anything related to the aquarium hobby seems to get answered as I continue reading the posts.

I still have a lot more reading to do but I wanted to say hello and post a question that I haven’t found the answer to yet.

[jeej]

I'm sure you'll get far more knowledgeable people than myself respond, but I just wanted to say that I have had great success using a Japanese product called Geo Liquid. They sell a variety specifically for use with crustaceans. Basically it helps to find a balance in your water parameters suitable for the shrimp. It stabilises the water, makes it crystal clear, and perfect for your shrimp to grow their exoskeletons. I've also used Seachem Prime as water treatment.

As for your filter - I don't have anything anywhere near as hardcore as what you are quoting. A lot of shrimp keepers just use a sponge filter. The important part is making sure that the shrimp don't get absolutely battered by your filtration system and that the babies don't get sucked into any part of it.

Cherry Shrimp really shouldn't be hard to care for. Unless, like me, you put green rocks in your tank and let copper kill them! It is debateable just how much (or little) copper it can take to harm shrimp, but the general rule is don't mix copper and shrimp.

Anyway, bring on the experts...

[nick11380]

I never heard of Geo Liquid. I'll have to look into it.

In the aquarium I have an aquaclear 30 with a foam filter insert over the intake so no shrimp get sucked in. It's a 10 gallon shrimp only tank.

This 5 stage counter top water filter is what I use in the kitchen for drinking water. It filters out all the ammonia,chorine and other nasty stuff that's in the tap water and I'm wondering if it's safe to use this filter as an alterative to an R/O filter. I think that it would be better to used filtered water than just treating tap water with prime. But I'm not sure about the copper uses in stage 2.

It's funny you mentioned green rocks. I have a big green rock about the size of both fists together. It kind of looks like quartz with a medium green tint. It's been sitting around the house for years and I was thinking that it might look good in an aquarium. But now that you said that. I won't put it in.

[jeej]

I don't trust any rocks with green in them now! Got my fingers burnt!

You'll know if copper is harming your shrimp because they swim along mid water slowly, almost drifting, then suddenly and very dramatically jolt and flick across the tank like they have been electrocuted.

Otherwise Cherry Shrimp should just busy themselves around the tank, gracefully picking away at plants and stones, or hiding for a day or so after molting.

[Neonshrimp]

Hi and welcome nick11380,

jeej just about covered it all

Anyway I counted 4 baby shrimp. Hopefully there are more that I can’t see.

There are more hiding, trust me on that one.

If your babies are surviving and doing well then you don't have to worry about copper. I would remember the description jeej about symptoms/behavior of shrimp with acute copper poisoning. As long as the shrimp are moving about and scavenging normally they are fine.

Hope you enjoy your "water bugs" and watch out you just might get bitten by the shrimp bug

[Guba]

I also have copper pipes.

I have copper pipes too and the amount of contact time the water has with it is not of any consequence. I've been keeping fish about as long as you also. I do have to admit that you have me flabergasted on your filter system. In the past I've had water problems do to oil well drilling. For about 4 years my water changes were killing my fish (well water). What I ended up doing was to catch my rainwater during a storm. The water is of course VERY soft and acidic. If you do this, let the water sit and age at least a week. Fish always got ich when it didn't age. During that period I managed to breed neon tetras, but I didn't know at the time that they were light sensitive, the fry never got to free swimming. Soft acidic water is easier to change the chemistry of than hard alkaline water. If you want to raise the PH use something like tufa stone, dolomite or aragonite, they will keep you water more stable than chemical additions. And by the way, I also think shrimp taste awesome! They may look like a bug to you, but they're gooood!

[nick11380]

Since nobody said that my counter top water filter water would be bad for shrimp I'm going to experament with it. Unless I get some objections.

I bought a new 10 gallon aquarium. I'll fill it up with (counter top water filter) water. Take an aquaclear 30 out of one of my goldfish tanks and put it in the new aquarium so the new tank should be intantly cycled. Then on monday (if the water tests good for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate) I'll add some shrimp and see how they do.

Any thoughts or objections?

[Neonshrimp]

When setting up the new 10 gal try to put in some of the water you recently did on an established tank. This will help cycle the new tank and ease the shock the new water will have on the bacteria in the filter. Best wishes and let us know how it goes.

[nick11380]

I usually use 50% old tank water when setting up a new aquarium. Although I wasn't planning on it this time because I was going to experament with the "water filter" water. I've been taking my time setting up the aquarium and only have it half full with "water filter" water. I'll fill the other half with old tank water now that you mention it. My fish tanks have been treated with stress coat. Will the Sodium Triosulfate still be in the tank from the stress coat? I read that stress coat isn't good for shrimp because of the Sodium Triosulfate.

[Neonshrimp]

I usually use 50% old tank water when setting up a new aquarium. Although I wasn't planning on it this time because I was going to experament with the "water filter" water. I've been taking my time setting up the aquarium and only have it half full with "water filter" water. I'll fill the other half with old tank water now that you mention it. My fish tanks have been treated with stress coat. Will the Sodium Triosulfate still be in the tank from the stress coat? I read that stress coat isn't good for shrimp because of the Sodium Triosulfate.

I guess you can use whatever amout (%) of the water you want. Just acclimate the animals slower if you are going to use more of the filtered water to prevent shock. I guess the Sodium Triosulfate will remain in the water until it is removed with the water or until it changes by bonding/breaking down into another compound.

[badflash]

Since nobody said that my counter top water filter water would be bad for shrimp I'm going to experament with it. Unless I get some objections.

I bought a new 10 gallon aquarium. I'll fill it up with (counter top water filter) water. Take an aquaclear 30 out of one of my goldfish tanks and put it in the new aquarium so the new tank should be intantly cycled. Then on monday (if the water tests good for ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate) I'll add some shrimp and see how they do.

Any thoughts or objections?

Sorry I missed this. Many countertop water filters put significant amounts of silver ions into the water and do not remove the chloramines. I would steer clear of them.

I use a product called Kold-Steril and am quite happy with it.

[Guba]

I thought counter type water filters were nothing more than "fancy" charcoal filters. What kind of filter are we talking about? Is this something I can look at in Lowes/Home Depot?

[badflash]

I was talking about the Britta filter, but I'm sure others are similar. To find my filter (Kold-Steril), either google it, or check the adds on aquabid. Links to commercial websites are not permitted.

[Guba]

Alright, maybe I'm behind in water tech, the Britta filter that I know of was a "fancy charcoal filter". It attached to your faucet. It's nice to hear that home water tech advanced to something more than that.

[nick11380]

My water filter isn't a "fancy charcoal filter" like the Brita.

My counter top water filter is a five stage filter.

1. Stage (Mechanical filtration) #316 stainless steel screens. Prevents channelling, removes sediments without clogging. #316 stainless is the highest grade stainless mesh available.
2. Stage (Oxidation filtration) Mixture of pure zinc and electrolytic copper. Two dissimilar
metals with relative redox potentials which create conditions for spontaneous oxidation.
3. Stage (Mechanical filtration) Stainless steal screens-5 micron pad
4. Stage (adsorption filtration)S-A 50 GAC. Steam activated and designed to effectively remove both low and high molecular weight compounds. S-A 50 mesh GAC is the highest quality activated carbon available, and is used for maximum surface area which results in longer contact time and more effective adsorption.
5. Stage (mechanical filtration) Stainless steal screens- 5 micron pad.

Water test results from my counter top water filter (with API tests):
Ammonia 0, Chorine 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 5, KH 5, Copper (none detected) PH 8.2

Fish can live in unconditioned filtered water.

The filter stands 12 inches tall and measures 11.5 inches around. This filter is much more advanced than a Brita.

How do you find out if it puts silver ions in the water and if it filters out the chloramines?