Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

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Carolina
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Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Hi, Like many of you, I started with an Ecosphere. My niece from Brazil bought one and luckily she shipped to my house..... Within a day they were free :lol:
Also like many of you, I fell in love with these little guys..... and little by little started updating my tank.

My latest was a Fluval Chi, which I DO NOT recommend, unless you want to torture your little guys to death with that filter...... I tried my hardest with sponges, even a stocking..... Only to find out they were getting trapped for days on no end :evil:

Anyways, I took that evil filter off, changed the light, the cover, put a little filter with a sponge pre-filter on it wrapped with rubber bands, and wrapped the entire thing with stocking to make it even safer..... and now they are good.

My questions are - they seem to be thriving...... But my babies hardly come around - they hide and hide and HIDE - that's their favorite pass time.

Also - you will see on my pictures, I have a TONNAGE of green algae on my glass........ I do have a few small nerite (pipipi) snails, but for some reason they are anywhere but on the glass - it seems they prefer the rocks.

If anyone can help - it would be lovely!!

Oh yeah, my aquarium is planted - I have java fern, java moss, and a few marimo moss. The shrimp love them.
Thanks

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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Stalker »

Remove the filter, it's useless.
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Stalker wrote:Remove the filter, it's useless.
I removed the big one, which was causing me issues..... This little seems to work. I decreased the current considerably, but it seems that the Java Moss does need a bit of a current to thrive..... The amount of current on this one is not stressing the shrimp.... They are actually hanging by the filter without issues.

What I am really concerned about it is the green Algae....
I reduced the duration of the time I am leaving the light on..... But it's such a balance....
Should I just leave the algae there for the shrimp eat? Should I scrape it: Should I add pipipi snail?

Also, why are my shrimp hiding so much? Is it just the fact they have some many places to hide i.e. a lava moss cave, etc?
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Stalker »

I have no filter with my shrimps and my java moss grown very good. The filter only product nitrates and curent. And opae ula hate curent.
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Carolina
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Stalker wrote:The filter only product nitrates
What's the logic behind that?
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Stalker »

NH3+filter=NO2-
NO2-+filter=NO3-

Plants and algae doent love nitrates, they prefere ammonia. Before eating nitrates, their need to reduct it to ammonia again... and it consum energy. Nitrates concentrate in the water and you need water changes.

Without filter, the small amount of ammonia is available directly and plants grow faster. And there isn't any form of azote concentrating in the water, you dont even need any water change.

The filter is only needed for realy big or polluant fishs creating ammonia too fast for plants and for tanks without plants to remove ammonia (very toxic at high rate). In a normal tank it only create waste, slow down plant growth and stress animals. Sadly aquario-gadget's industry created the need to filter more and more... But almost all tanks work better without any filtration... Most people are just afraid to turn this crap off.

But for opae ula even Mustafa says it:
... You may also want to read some other people's current posts as these kinds of things are mentioned very frequently. I practically say "no filter needed or desired" in almost every other post. It makes no sense (and wastes everyone's time) to have to answer the same question 500+ times...
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Stalker wrote:NH3+filter=NO2-
NO2-+filter=NO3-

Plants and algae doent love nitrates, they prefere ammonia. Before eating nitrates, their need to reduct it to ammonia again... and it consum energy. Nitrates concentrate in the water and you need water changes.

Without filter, the small amount of ammonia is available directly and plants grow faster. And there isn't any form of azote concentrating in the water, you dont even need any water change.

The filter is only needed for realy big or polluant fishs creating ammonia too fast for plants and for tanks without plants to remove ammonia (very toxic at high rate). In a normal tank it only create waste, slow down plant growth and stress animals. Sadly aquario-gadget's industry created the need to filter more and more... But almost all tanks work better without any filtration... Most people are just afraid to turn this crap off.

But for opae ula even Mustafa says it:
... You may also want to read some other people's current posts as these kinds of things are mentioned very frequently. I practically say "no filter needed or desired" in almost every other post. It makes no sense (and wastes everyone's time) to have to answer the same question 500+ times...
Thanks for your answer - Like I said, I have been lurking this site for many months, and have seen this quote from Mustafa - only from himself, which sounds quite a bit better, honestly, IMHO. I have read Many many many posts. I have been reading this forum every day for months - it's not very active..... So I keep reading what comes up. I searched everything you could think of in relation to my tank. I am not just asking something just to ask. I am asking because I need help. Way for you, by the way, a newby, to make another newcomer to feel welcomed. Great going.
Yet.... have never seen Mustafa explain what you posted in re. to Nitrates. In fact, I can't find it anywhere on the web - I can find it from you, in mentions, but not as explained as above.
On Mustafa guide, which yes, I read plenty of times, he doesn't even mention having or not having a filter - he just doesn't mention a filter at all.

NOW - what I can tell you, is that this modified filter is NOT bothering my shrimp. They are actually hanging ON the filter - if they were bothered, would be there? I think not.

I came here with two questions -
1- An overgrowth of green algae in the tank walls (which I suspect was because my previous lid had LED strips too close to said walls)
1.1 - Should I control this growth? My understanding is that nerites will eat the algae in the substract too, risking not leaving enough food for the shrimp. Shoud I just scrape it off the walls? What's the best plan to reduce this without affecting the health of my shrimp? I am no longer feeding them as they are rejecting food - sign they have plenty in the tank.
2- the hiding - why do they hide so much? I see them on the walls, lava rocks, plants and such, but not actively swimming like I see in some videos.

If you can't help me with that, I hope someone else can.
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by KenCotigirl »

Hello Carolina. Glad you posted and added pictures. If you read my posts you know I am like it simple. Just a light, rocks, snails and macroalgae. Chemistry is not my strong suit. Cycling in aquariums you go from ammonia to nitrites to nitrates. You can google this cycle. Basically the same for fresh and salt water. Bacteria breakdown toxic ammonia to nitrites, another bacteria breaks down slightly less toxic nitrites to nitrates and algae consume nitrates for food. Ammonia is produced by animal life and the breakdown of food/waste. The bacteria live on surfaces. More surfaces more area to grow good bacteria.

Algae can be controlled by reducing the light duration and intensity and by reducing feeding the shrimp. For example you can reduce the light duration from 12 hours to 10 hours and reduce intensity by raising the light further from the water surface. If you feed every week then feed every other week or maybe once a month. You can scrap the front glass only for viewing and leave the other three sides alone for the snails and shrimp to feed off.

How many shrimp do you have? What size tank? With all the hiding places you may only see 1/3 to 1/2 or even less of your shrimp at any time. Remember these shrimp are benthic, crawl arround on tank bottom and surfaces, and not open water swimmers. While they do swim they seem to prefer crawling. My shrimp actively swim when they sense food otherwise they crawl about actively scraping surfaces for food.

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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

KenCotigirl wrote:Hello Carolina. Glad you posted and added pictures. If you read my posts you know I am like it simple. Just a light, rocks, snails and macroalgae. Chemistry is not my strong suit. Cycling in aquariums you go from ammonia to nitrites to nitrates. You can google this cycle. Basically the same for fresh and salt water. Bacteria breakdown toxic ammonia to nitrites, another bacteria breaks down slightly less toxic nitrites to nitrates and algae consume nitrates for food. Ammonia is produced by animal life and the breakdown of food/waste. The bacteria live on surfaces. More surfaces more area to grow good bacteria.

Algae can be controlled by reducing the light duration and intensity and by reducing feeding the shrimp. For example you can reduce the light duration from 12 hours to 10 hours and reduce intensity by raising the light further from the water surface. If you feed every week then feed every other week or maybe once a month. You can scrap the front glass only for viewing and leave the other three sides alone for the snails and shrimp to feed off.

How many shrimp do you have? What size tank? With all the hiding places you may only see 1/3 to 1/2 or even less of your shrimp at any time. Remember these shrimp are benthic, crawl arround on tank bottom and surfaces, and not open water swimmers. While they do swim they seem to prefer crawling. My shrimp actively swim when they sense food otherwise they crawl about actively scraping surfaces for food.

Ken
Hi Ken,

That explains a lot more, thank you!
My tank is 5 gallon, and I have 50 or so shrimp in it. They are doing quite well :D
I test the Ammonia all the time, and there is none, so we are good there. I barely see any shrimp around the tank - maybe one or two swimming...... some grazing the algae on the wall.... But most of them are on the substract ( and I really need to look for them), of hiding in the lava rock cave. The do like to hang on the sponge filter too, it seems, and I see some on the java fern leaves.
I fed them a few times, but then I noticed they were not eating..... My tank has plenty of food for them, I guess, so I decided to not feed anymore - it's been a while. I see them eating, and eliminating, so I know they are getting food from the aquarium itself.
I decided to reduce the time I have the light on - I had it for 12 hours - now I have for 8-10.
I also ordered some Tiger Nerite Snails..... I am a bit unsure about this move though...... As while I want to clean the walls, I don'r want to clean the substract and the rocks.
Question Ken - what do you think about those night lights? My light has a day time, and a blue night light - should I use that? Is that helpful/harmful?
Thank you for clarifying, I was thinking something was wrong with my shrimp for no swimming so much :?:
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Stalker »

My idea: stop feeding your shrimps for a time, they will take control of the algae maybe.
And algae are known to eat nitrates more easily than plants, so the filter may help algae to grow. Dit you tried to add some Melanoïdes tuberculata? It's easy to adapt to brackish water.

I let algae grow on walls on all my tanks, it's natural and I think its important to let them have a place
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Thanks Stalker.... But I no longer feed them... Haven't for a while. I have enough food in the aquarium itself...
Haven't tried those snails as I heard they work better cleaning the substrate, and not the walls.... That would be counterproductive for my shrimp, imho.
For the pattern of the algae growth, I think the issue was excessive light (the problem is on the glasses near where the led strips were located).
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by KenCotigirl »

Carolina I use led lights 3 tanks. One has the blue light but it is at work so I never use it. A buddy of mine uses it on his fish tank. Some of his fish come out at night with the blue light on. I do not think the shrimp care about the blue light one way or the other. Do you notice any behavior change?

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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Hi Ken,
The light is too new....
To be honest, the biggest positive change was the sponge filter. They are definitely coming out more. They LOVE grazing on it, and the water is very clean. I notice more shrimps on the walls and swimming as well.
The color of the shrimp doesn't really stand out with the blue light.... So I can't tell when it's on if they are around more....
What I am trying to do is to create a night/day shift, per say, as the water does get really dark.... More in tune with nature. Without it, the tank still gets the light from the room.
For what I read, this day/night regular cycle is healthy for them..... But it remains to be seen....
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by shwin »

i doub it is the filter and I would rather have nitrate than ammonia. Ammonia is more deadly to aquaria livestock and it is going to convert to nitrite then nitrate with or without a filter. Whether you have high ammonia, nitrite, or nitrates the treatment is the same, change the water. So doesn't it sound better to have something in your tank that is safer if the intervention is the same as the more dangerous ammonia?

But honestly you would probably only need a filter if you have a high bioload which shrimp hardly have. As for as the algae, try scraping it off and then reducing the amount of food you feed to encourage the snails to eat what's growing in the tank as opposed to supplemented food. Also try exposing the aquarium To less light. Javas and marimo are Low light plants they will be fine. Check your nitrate and phos levels too as they can cause algae.

PS my shrimp hide too. I turned off my sponge filter for a week with no improvement in activity. But I do notice they like to graze the sponge.

How long has this tank been established?
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Re: Have been lurking for a long time..... Now need help....

Post by Carolina »

Oh boy, now I have a whole other issue....
See my last picture?
You will notice that my substrate is pebbles over aragonite sand.
Well, I just rescued a shrimp that was trapped in it for a couple of days.... Unfortunately I don't think it made it.
It did get out alive, but it's now a day later laying belly up :(
I am concerned about this subtract being trapping my little guys.
I have a super long tweezer that I can carefully pull one by one, but there is definitely algae in them.... Is there going to be food left for them to graze on? I don't want to move my lava rocks and risk smashing them up.
The lava has plenty food on them to graze.... The glass... It's a party!
What do you guys think? Do I remove this substrate and leave the aragonite sand as much as I can?
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