Why ramshorns in shrimp tanks?

JohnPaul · Post by **JohnPaul** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:07 pm

In browsing through the forum, I see a lot of references to people having ramshorn snails in their shrimp tanks, and I am a bit perplexed as to why.

MTS make sense (especially with sand substrates), since they are good for substrate aeration and general cleanup, yet don't eat live plants at all.

But I was under the impression ramshorns are somewhat notorious for tearing through live plants, which seems to me to make them a not-very-good idea in a planted shrimp tank.

Can anyone explain?

YuccaPatrol · Post by **YuccaPatrol** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 7:43 pm

The red ramshorn snail (Planorbis corneus) is great in planted tanks. It eats algae and detritus and never eats living plants, but it will eat dead plant matter.

All, in all a great snail for the shrimp or planted tank.

The Columbian ramshorn snail (Marisa cornuarietis) that you see sold in fish stores is a voracious plant eater.

Definitely don't confuse the two if you like your plants alive

JohnPaul · Post by **JohnPaul** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 8:31 pm

Ahhhhhhh......

That was the piece of info I was missing. I was under the impression red ramshorns were just a color variant of the same species.

Thanks for saving me a disaster!

ToddnBecka · Post by **ToddnBecka** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 9:03 pm

Actually, the only reason I have ramshorns in my shrimp tank is that they arrived with some live plants. They aren't Colombian's, or I wouldn't have any plants left by now.

I do, however, see some holes and chewed leaves on some plants. The dwarf water lily suffers the worst, the leaves look like swiss cheese a few days after they grow. Only thing is, I'm not sure whethe it's the snails, or the cherry shrimp doing the deed. I have seen the cherry shrimp eat (very slowly, over a period of several weeks) an Aponogetum bulb that apparently wasn't going to grow. Most of them sprouted within a week, a couple became shrimp food. I have also seen cherry shrimp apparently eating duckweed. Occaisonally there willl be one "riding" below the little leaf cluster as it sinks, picking away the whole time. Riccia also seems to be on their menu, I tossed a load into the tank, have maybe 15-20% left.

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 9:21 pm

I do, however, see some holes and chewed leaves on some plants. The dwarf water lily suffers the worst, the leaves look like swiss cheese a few days after they grow.

I read that the snails will eat plants if they are in large numbers and also if there is not enough food for them to scavenge. Is this your experience?

ToddnBecka · Post by **ToddnBecka** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:12 pm

It's probably the ramshorns that have been chewing the holes, but I do see shrimp on the water lily leaves all the time. I'm just not sure whether they are eating the leaves as they develop holes and turn brown, or are responsible for the holes to begin with.

I've been wanting to add a dwarf puffer to the tank to knock down the ramshorn population, but haven't seen any available locally for months. I figure with all the plants and snails in the tank, the puffer should leave the shrimp alone. Snails are easier prey. I doubt one puffer will eradicate them all, but should control them effectively over time.

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:34 pm

Be very careful with the dwarf puffer! Even one can do alot of damage to a shrimp populations if it developes a liking to the taste of shrimp. I have heard this is the case but if anyone knows different please let us know. Just beware

ToddnBecka · Post by **ToddnBecka** » Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:49 pm

I plan to watch the critter closely, but casn't think of a better way to off the ramshorns. I tried crushing the big ones for shrimp food, but they just keep breeding.

The only other way I can think of would be to move out all the shrimp (time-consuming hassle, particularly in a planted tank) and dose with copper sulfate. I did that a few months ago to kill a hydra infestation, but the shrimp have multiplied considerably since then. 20/20 hindsight, should have left all the ramshorns in there too. The MTS aren't a problem.

JohnPaul · Post by **JohnPaul** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 4:40 am

If you could find one, I would think a DP would eradicate your snail population pretty quickly. They have voracious appetites and are true hunters, so they will find any snails that are in there.

Another non-chemical option would be to temporarily add a very small loach. In my 29g community tank I had so many MTS I didn't know what to do, if I came in the room at night and turned on the light, I could easily count 50+ on the glass & driftwood at any given time.

I put in ONE small Dwarf Chain Loach (a much smaller cousin to the yoyo loach; only reaches about 2" long at full growth). A month later, my snail population is zero. The tank can be in the tank, I will come in and turn on the light...nothing.

(Well, nothing except a TON of empty MTS shells everywhere!) I put him in to "control" the snail population, instead he wiped it out. Ahh well, what can you do...

Shrimp&Snails · Post by **Shrimp&Snails** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 6:04 am

I keep red and blue ramshorns (in seperate tanks) with my shrimp and have noticed the blues tend to eat my live plants but the reds don't.

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 9:00 am

So red ramshorns are good and blue ramshorns are bad for planted tanks. I will be checking my tanks again. Thanks Shrimp&Snails and Yucca.

zwergkrebszuechter · Post by **zwergkrebszuechter** » Sat Sep 23, 2006 3:51 pm

Actually blue and red ramshorn snails are the same species. Why should one color morph eat plants and the other does not?
Are you sure that your plants are live and healthy and the snails do not just eat the part rotting away?

Shrimp&Snails · Post by **Shrimp&Snails** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:35 am

I'm aware that blues and reds are the same species.....i'm merely passing on info I have witnessed happening in my tanks.

For some reason the reds don't eat my java moss which is the same quality moss that is in my blue's tank but the blue's java moss is always littered with blues. The reds don't seem to crawl all over less that healthy elodea densa like the blues do either.

I don't like what they are doing....especially as I have bred the blues to sell and can't lie to my customers when they ask if they eat plants.

This isn't a snail forum but my blues have also savaged my bridgesii....gnawing holes in their operculums and eating them alive. I only have five brigs left now which have been moved to a ramshorn free tank.

I keep my reds with asolene spixi and brigs with zero problems.

zwergkrebszuechter · Post by **zwergkrebszuechter** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:44 am

Maybe it is rather because of the tank and your blue snails are hungry all the time? I have never witnessed mine eating plants or mystery snails. vice versa it is the case. Mystery snails eat small ramshorns and ramshorn eggs.

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Sun Sep 24, 2006 9:45 am

I don't like what they are doing....especially as I have bred the blues to sell and can't lie to my customers when they ask if they eat plants.

Thank you for sharing and your honesty is much appreciated.