Hi Mustafa et al,
So I received a small ecosphere over a month ago via Groupon, but after viewing your site I agree that however cool it looks it's basically a Thunderdome for shrimp.
I'm planning on transferring them out to a larger aquarium (1-2 gallons) and ordering some more supershrimp from the site to form their own little society, but I figure that as long as I'm putting together an aquarium, might as well make it interesting.
I've always wanted a saltwater aquarium but know I can't put these guys in with any fish because of the difference in salinity requirements and because they're basically prey. I would love to get some living coral or anemones though, so I was wondering if there are any that would compatibly live with these shrimp? Are there any that could either survive the brackish water, or can the shrimp survive a slightly higher salinity to accommodate the coral? They'll be set up in my office where they get at least 12 hours of artificial light and climate control every day. I checked out the guidelines and some of the other threads, including the one with no punctuation I couldn't understand, but it's not clear to me what if anything else I can populate the tank with.
Thanks!
Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Moderator: Mustafa
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Hi shrimpy4! 
I'm glad you have decided to give your shrimp a better home. There are several issues with corals in a Supershrimp tank. One issue is that, as far as I know, almost all corals need full strength ocean salinity. There may be some species out there that are adapted to more brackish conditions (maybe close to river deltas), but those are almost certainly not sold in stores. Supershrimp seem to prefer living in brackish water. There are no known populations living directly in the ocean. There is one man-made habitat that has higher than ocean salinity, but I suspect that these shrimp only temporarily venture to higher salinities before retreating to more brackish water within the porous volcanic rock. I have never kept Supershrimp at ocean water salinities for extended periods of time, so I can't really tell you if they would do fine in the long term and even reproduce.
Also, corals and anemones could possibly prey on these tiny shrimp. Even harmless looking stony corals extend their polyps at night to catch zooplankton (which includes small shrimp and their larvae). There is really not much you can keep with these shrimp besides snails. There may be some other brackish water non-predatory animals that could potentially be kept with them, but none of them are available at this point.
The best thing you can really do for your shrimp is to prepare a brackish tank with a fine gravel or sandy substrate with some rocky decorations (including some calcium carbonate rocks to maintain alkalinity), and, possibly, some snails. As I have said in another thread, I do have a type of Chaetomorpha macroalga species that seems to be especially adapted to brackish water, so that is another option for decoration.
I'm glad you have decided to give your shrimp a better home. There are several issues with corals in a Supershrimp tank. One issue is that, as far as I know, almost all corals need full strength ocean salinity. There may be some species out there that are adapted to more brackish conditions (maybe close to river deltas), but those are almost certainly not sold in stores. Supershrimp seem to prefer living in brackish water. There are no known populations living directly in the ocean. There is one man-made habitat that has higher than ocean salinity, but I suspect that these shrimp only temporarily venture to higher salinities before retreating to more brackish water within the porous volcanic rock. I have never kept Supershrimp at ocean water salinities for extended periods of time, so I can't really tell you if they would do fine in the long term and even reproduce.
Also, corals and anemones could possibly prey on these tiny shrimp. Even harmless looking stony corals extend their polyps at night to catch zooplankton (which includes small shrimp and their larvae). There is really not much you can keep with these shrimp besides snails. There may be some other brackish water non-predatory animals that could potentially be kept with them, but none of them are available at this point.
The best thing you can really do for your shrimp is to prepare a brackish tank with a fine gravel or sandy substrate with some rocky decorations (including some calcium carbonate rocks to maintain alkalinity), and, possibly, some snails. As I have said in another thread, I do have a type of Chaetomorpha macroalga species that seems to be especially adapted to brackish water, so that is another option for decoration.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Hi Mustafa,
Thanks much for your input, really appreciate it. Definitely seems like coral isn't going to be the way to go. What about brackish plants? I'm looking at the plants listed on sites like this one: http://www.plantgeek.net/plantguide_list.php?category=8
and have found places to order them online. But would plants like these upset the CO2/O2/algae balance too much for these guys, or would they help to keep the environment healthy?
Thanks
Thanks much for your input, really appreciate it. Definitely seems like coral isn't going to be the way to go. What about brackish plants? I'm looking at the plants listed on sites like this one: http://www.plantgeek.net/plantguide_list.php?category=8
and have found places to order them online. But would plants like these upset the CO2/O2/algae balance too much for these guys, or would they help to keep the environment healthy?
Thanks
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Unfortunately, all of those plants, except for the Mangrove, would just rot and die at the higher salinity brackish water these shrimp prefer. There are lots of articles out there about freshwater plants that supposedly survive in "brackish water", but what they fail to mention is that they only survive (and mostly not thrive) in extremely low salinity brackish water...it's still almost freshwater that they are talking about. These shrimp live at twice to four+ times that kind of salinity. A mangrove is not a real option as it becomes a huge tree. It does not even work well for huge reef aquaria as you need to provide strong lighting for a Mangrove. As the Mangrove gets bigger, you need more light...before you know it either your Mangrove dead due to insufficient lighting, or your room has turned into a fully lighted grow room.
Either way, putting plants into a Supershrimp tank is kind of counterproductive anyway. Plants need nutrients and shrimp in general need extremely nutrient-poor water. You feed these shrimp only once or twice a month with tiny amounts of food...that's not enough to keep any higher plants alive. On the other hand, if you fertilize a shrimp tank to keep the plants alive your shrimp won't do well (and probably die one by one "suddenly"). The special brackish water Chaetomorpha sp. that I have in some of my tanks only does well because it just sits there and waits for nutrients (without dying) for weeks or even months and only grows when nutrients become available...however sporadic that may be. Even so...it's still competes with the surface colonizing basic algae on which the shrimp feed...just not enough to suppress their growth (unless the Chaetomorpha sp. fills almost the whole tank...more than about half anyway..).
Either way, putting plants into a Supershrimp tank is kind of counterproductive anyway. Plants need nutrients and shrimp in general need extremely nutrient-poor water. You feed these shrimp only once or twice a month with tiny amounts of food...that's not enough to keep any higher plants alive. On the other hand, if you fertilize a shrimp tank to keep the plants alive your shrimp won't do well (and probably die one by one "suddenly"). The special brackish water Chaetomorpha sp. that I have in some of my tanks only does well because it just sits there and waits for nutrients (without dying) for weeks or even months and only grows when nutrients become available...however sporadic that may be. Even so...it's still competes with the surface colonizing basic algae on which the shrimp feed...just not enough to suppress their growth (unless the Chaetomorpha sp. fills almost the whole tank...more than about half anyway..).
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Noted, many thanks for your reply! Guess I'll focus on some snazzy decorations and maybe some dead coral. I was at PetCo the other day and the directions on the gravel bag I was looking at suggested rinsing in tap water but I think I would also rinse/soak them and any other rocks in distilled water instead. I noticed in one of the other threads that when someone set up a new tank with new rocks all of their shrimp died off! I'll keep my fingers crossed that doesn't happen to the ecosphere prisoners and that they get along well with the new ones I'm ordering.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
You're welcome. This is really the best way to go. As for rinsing in tap water..it should be ok...the amount of chloramine in the remaining water on the rocks (after rinsing) should not pose any problems as the amounts are really minute compared to the tank volume. If you want to be on the safe side you can always throw a double dose of dechlorinator in there.
Rocks don't generally cause problems. The person reporting problems must have had some other issues...chemicals, tank cycle issues...something not directly related to the composition of the rock. And, as you said it was a new tank, the most likely culprit is just "new tank syndrome." A new tank should run for a month or more before any animals are introduced so the microfauna and microflora that support life in it has time to establish itself. That applies to tanks without filters, too.
Rocks don't generally cause problems. The person reporting problems must have had some other issues...chemicals, tank cycle issues...something not directly related to the composition of the rock. And, as you said it was a new tank, the most likely culprit is just "new tank syndrome." A new tank should run for a month or more before any animals are introduced so the microfauna and microflora that support life in it has time to establish itself. That applies to tanks without filters, too.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Hi Mustafa,
Quick question, about how much water comes with the shrimp that we order? I've finally purchased a 1-gallon bowl, laid a substrate (gravel with some cleaned eggshells), rinsed everything with tap water, mixed some Instant Ocean at 50% of recommendation (1/4 of a cup per gallon, though I ordered a hydrometer to test the PPT since I had to drain some so I'm afraid it may be low) and have ordered some inert, natural coral that I'm going to place and let sit for a few days.
I'm going to wait about a week to move the shrimp from my small ecosphere to the main bowl. Before I do that I'll probably have to dump some of the water out of the 1 gallon bowl, because it's almost full and I want to dump everything in the ecosphere into the bowl. If I'm going to add the water from the shrimp that I order too, I was wondering how much water comes with between 10-15 shrimp? Are they packaged individually or in one big bag? Thanks!
Quick question, about how much water comes with the shrimp that we order? I've finally purchased a 1-gallon bowl, laid a substrate (gravel with some cleaned eggshells), rinsed everything with tap water, mixed some Instant Ocean at 50% of recommendation (1/4 of a cup per gallon, though I ordered a hydrometer to test the PPT since I had to drain some so I'm afraid it may be low) and have ordered some inert, natural coral that I'm going to place and let sit for a few days.
I'm going to wait about a week to move the shrimp from my small ecosphere to the main bowl. Before I do that I'll probably have to dump some of the water out of the 1 gallon bowl, because it's almost full and I want to dump everything in the ecosphere into the bowl. If I'm going to add the water from the shrimp that I order too, I was wondering how much water comes with between 10-15 shrimp? Are they packaged individually or in one big bag? Thanks!
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Hmm..never really measured the amount of water I put in exactly, but it should be somewhere around 150-200 ml...and the shrimp are usually all in one bag unless it's a humongous order.shrimpy4 wrote:Hi Mustafa,
Quick question, about how much water comes with the shrimp that we order?
If I'm going to add the water from the shrimp that I order too, I was wondering how much water comes with between 10-15 shrimp? Are they packaged individually or in one big bag? Thanks!
Don't use coral. Use Dry Pukani Dry Rock.
Don't use coral or marine live rock. Too many organisms and organic material that will decay in non-full strength saltwater, even when cured for a long time. I would recommend using dry eco rock or dry pukani rock. It has no living or dead material on it. It looks incredible and has many interior nooks and crannies and dark hiding places for your shrimp. And its very light and porous and easily sculpted or hollowed out with a drill or dremel tool. Just cure it for a few weeks outdoors so algae can grow on it.
Photo from AquaNerd http://blog.aquanerd.com/2011/04/review ... -rock.html
I had 2 pieces of dry eco rock in my breeding aquarium a few years ago:
Photo from AquaNerd http://blog.aquanerd.com/2011/04/review ... -rock.html
I had 2 pieces of dry eco rock in my breeding aquarium a few years ago:
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
So after letting my tank cycle for a week last Friday I finally opened up my Ecosphere and transferred the contents, including 4 supershrimp, into my 1 gallon bowl. It's been nearly 3 days and the water is a little cloudy, and smells a bit off, not sulfury/rotten but more like stale seawater. Smells a bit stronger than just briney.
I think the problem may be some old seashells I had rinsed and placed in the bowl that same day. One of them was an old sea urchin shell, today I noticed some cloudy/opaque fungusy looking material on it so I've removed it from the water.
Is this potentially a bacterial bloom? Like I mentioned the smell is very reminiscent of a strong-smelling tidal pool. I don't own any PH testing kits yet but I can pick one up. So far I've replaced about 20-25% of the water with freshly mixed Distilled/Instant Ocean and the overall salinity is 1.010 SG.
I'm wondering if there's anything else I can/should do to balance out the environment? All four shrimp are still alive and don't seem distressed...of course I don't know what a distressed shrimp looks like.
The potential culprits. You can see the orangey/yellowish buildup on the nubs that formed in the water.
Edit: Also ernopena, thanks much for the suggestion. The old seashells likely contributed to the haze, though I'm hoping it's purely due to that urchin shell. I'm not really sure where one goes about getting the Pucani rock though, I also don't have much space to work in (just the 1-gallon bowl).
I think the problem may be some old seashells I had rinsed and placed in the bowl that same day. One of them was an old sea urchin shell, today I noticed some cloudy/opaque fungusy looking material on it so I've removed it from the water.
Is this potentially a bacterial bloom? Like I mentioned the smell is very reminiscent of a strong-smelling tidal pool. I don't own any PH testing kits yet but I can pick one up. So far I've replaced about 20-25% of the water with freshly mixed Distilled/Instant Ocean and the overall salinity is 1.010 SG.
I'm wondering if there's anything else I can/should do to balance out the environment? All four shrimp are still alive and don't seem distressed...of course I don't know what a distressed shrimp looks like.
The potential culprits. You can see the orangey/yellowish buildup on the nubs that formed in the water.
Edit: Also ernopena, thanks much for the suggestion. The old seashells likely contributed to the haze, though I'm hoping it's purely due to that urchin shell. I'm not really sure where one goes about getting the Pucani rock though, I also don't have much space to work in (just the 1-gallon bowl).
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Hmmm....generally the water should not be that cloudy at all. It's always best to wait until the water is crystal clear and some algae are growing on the substrate and on the glass before putting the shrimp in there. Any time frame given for when the shrimp can be put in is just a guideline as everyone's environment is different. It can actually take several weeks for some people before their tank is ready for Supershrimp. In my experience putting some of my brackish Chaetomorpha in newly established tanks first greatly accelerates the cycling process as the macroalga introduces beneficial microorganisms in addition to absorbing nitrates, ammonia, phosphates etc.
In any case, maybe some of your sea shells still had some biological material in them that rotted away and caused a bacteria bloom. If you can find any rotting tissue in their, remove it. If not, just don't do anything. Just let the tank sit there until you see some algae grow. You don't need to measure Ph or anything. You also don't need to change the water. Just let the tank sit there and let it find its biological balance before possibly putting in any more shrimp.
In any case, maybe some of your sea shells still had some biological material in them that rotted away and caused a bacteria bloom. If you can find any rotting tissue in their, remove it. If not, just don't do anything. Just let the tank sit there until you see some algae grow. You don't need to measure Ph or anything. You also don't need to change the water. Just let the tank sit there and let it find its biological balance before possibly putting in any more shrimp.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Appreciate the input Mustafa, there was definitely some organic material on some of the old seashells when I first placed them. I washed the urchin shells thoroughly but after a day they bloomed yellow gunk all over the old spine holes so I removed them. The shrimp seemed fine, a mix of swimming and hanging out on the coral and shells. Looking forward to the Chetamorpha being available, I'll place that in the bowl for a week or two to help balance things out and hopefully the remaining shrimp will last in the meantime before I place some more.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Now that I've been looking more closely the past few days, it's clear that they aren't moving very much. They basically just sit in place most of the day, one of them hides most of the time (he's also the one that's almost never red, he spends most of the day gray). They're big fans of the white birds nest coral though, they spend most of their time on it. Looking forward to getting the Chaetomorpha in there to help balance the environment.
Regarding the organic material, does some of that white skin/film from the inside of the eggshells count? I removed most of it before I mixed it into the gravel, but there's some still on there. If it's better I remove it I'll take it out. I really hope these last three guys make it!!
Regarding the organic material, does some of that white skin/film from the inside of the eggshells count? I removed most of it before I mixed it into the gravel, but there's some still on there. If it's better I remove it I'll take it out. I really hope these last three guys make it!!
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
The egg shell "skin" is actually antibacterial...even in freshwater it does not break down for months and months, so it should not cause any bacterial bloom at all.
Re: Any corals compatible with supershrimp?
Good to know about the eggshells. And I'm really glad I picked up the Chaeto, the stuff is terrific. There must still have been some sort of imbalance in the bowl beforehand, not only did one die but the more I paid attention I noticed they didn't move very much, and one was almost never red, but always gray and hiding. After just a couple of days with it in there it seems like all three are red and they spend a ton of time on/in it and are much more active.