A new home for old shrimp

[Rockhopper]

Hello all. After having opae'ula for about 1.5 years in the same tank, I've decided to give them a bigger, bright home. I originally purchased them from fukubonsai. The stock 'Tank' is probably less than a half gallon. I've fed them maybe once a month but the algae started to get out of hand so I stop about 9 months ago. Only maintance was water top off after that. They look healthy (bright red) but I've lost 3 since so far (3 remain).

Since this is my first tank, I've already run into 'order of operations' errors (such as filling the bowl with water before adding rocks or sand). Please let me know if you notice anything that seems out of sorts! Advice is welcomed and wanted

For setup:
- 1 gallon glass bowl (actual volume is around 0.8 gal)
- Medium grain white sand
- about 0.5 lb of rock
- small bunch of java moss
- 1 nerite
- Redsea salt
- ambient light only
- no heater or filtration

Day 1: mixed salt and distilled water to be between 1/3 and 1/4 seawater salinity as per instructions. Rinsed sand with distilled water and drained. Added sand and water to bowl

Day 3: broke up some rocks from LFS, washed and rinsed in distilled. Use one rock to hold down java moss. I eventually want to have a carpet but don't think this is the way about it. Added the nerite

Now it is time to wait and cycle. I'll also be receiving some moss balls today that I will dump in. I don't think that my javamoss will form a carpet with my half-hearted set up. Does anyone have advice?

[Varanus]

Any particular reason you have java moss in there? As far as I know its not a saltwater plant, and perhaps it doing poorly is a reason for your algae problems and shrimp deaths (i.e. organic matter breaking down from the moss is feeding the algae and having a toxic effect on the shrimp).

Three adult shrimp dying like that is just a bit of a worrying sign to me. I've had my supershrimp for close to a year and a half as well and as far as I know not a single adult shrimp has died.

[Rockhopper]

To clarify, this tank is 3 days old and no shrimp have been added yet. The old tank referenced is not shown. I put in java because I want to have a hardy plant to remove nutrients and I've read they do fine in brackish. I'd love to have a nice carpet but not sure if it is feasible in my set up. I'll keep an eye on it to make sure it isn't breaking down and remove it if necessary

[Varanus]

Yeah I'd be careful. Wikipedia at least only says they tolerate "weakly" brackish water, and supershrimp water is recommended to be about half the strength of sea water.

Mustafa's moss balls and macroalgae seem to do fine though if you ever need alternatives.

[Rockhopper]

The more I read, the more you are correct. I think I'm confusing myself since different groups are measuring salinity in different ways.

http://www.aquascapingworld.com/threads ... -ups.4751/

This guy lists java moss/ferns tolerating 'high salinities' up to '-1005ppm'. Not sure what the negative implies but this come out to be ~0.1% salt. Coming to learn that brackish encompasses a wide range of salinities..

I'll continue to monitor the moss. Since the bowl is cycling there isn't a danger to the shrimp

[Rockhopper]

I'm now two weeks into cycling. The java moss still looks healthy but I haven't noticed any growth. I added some 'salt water' marimos that seem to be doing well.

The nerite spends most of his time at the top of the bowl. I gave him some spirilla powder since the algae has yet to kick off. Tried giving him blanched carrots and zucchini but he wasn't interested.

My main problem now is the water has become cloudy. Considering doing a water change...

[Rockhopper]

Should I just wait out this cloudy phase or perform a few water changes? I think it was preemptive to add the nerite but I had read they expediated the cycle

[JennyPenny]

My advice is to wait. The cloudiness will settle on its own.

[minishrimps]

i wouldn't add veggies for your nerite, if it is spending more time on the waterline chances are there is something going on with the water quality. The more food you add the more likely you are to have water quality issues, especially with such a small water volume. I think Jenny is right, wait it out... don't add anything...

[Mustafa]

Take out the java moss immediately. The fact that java moss (and some other plants like java fern) have the ability to stay green for weeks and sometimes months despite actually *dying* (and releasing unwanted organics into your water) in even low brackish water has fooled many people over decades who are still spreading misinformation about these supposed "brackish water" plants.

The person in the link you provided doesn't even know the difference between "specific gravity" (SG) and "parts per million" (ppm) so how much can you trust all the other information that he/she is providing? A measurement like "1.005" is actually SG (specific) gravity, not ppm. Nobody uses ppm for salinity measurements in the hobby. People usually use ppt (parts per thousand) or SG. 1.005 SG is about about 6.633 ppt. That would translate to 6633 ppm. Again...after reading this you should kinda get an idea about the knowledge level of the person posting the "advice" in the link.

At 1.005 SG java moss dies...slowly but surely. It even dies at 1.002 or 1.003SG, maybe a bit more slowly. Our Supershrimp tanks usually range from anywhere between 1.008 to 1.013 (sometimes a bit higher...sometimes a bit lower). NO freshwater plant that is labeled as "brackish tolerant" will survive in our Supershrimp tanks, no matter how long they look like they're alive (but actually dead or dying while still green).

So, take out the java moss, don't put in any more freshwater plants and just wait. Don't mess with the tank too much. I would even recommend taking out the nerite snail...eats and poops too much and generally isn't really a good fit as a permanent resident of a Supershrimp tank that shouldn't get fed for weeks or even months (the tank, not the snail). The only snails that I have seen so far keep up with such a feeding schedule are the brackish water snails sold right here on this website.

If you haven't already, just search the keyword "plants" or any other keyword you're interested in in this forum and you'll see tons of posts (a lot of them by me) basically repeating this information. I should probably put this in an article finally.

[Rockhopper]

Ok, java moss is getting pulled when I get home. I was initially confused by the poster's measurement of salinity but chalked it up to my inexperience. Hopefully I can salvage the moss in a separate bowl. The water has improved slightly but there is a thin milky film developing at the surface that is concerning.

I'll probably place an order later for your macroalgae. Does the algae take well to beds/carpets?

Thank you all for responses

[Mustafa]

No, the macroalgae just grow in a clump that keeps getting bigger. If you want to separate it and attach it with fishing line or similar to rocks, you could do that for decoration purposes. As for carpets...the supershrimp mossballs do kinda form a carpet by filling up the entire bottom of a tank over time. Check out the video clip of one of my mossball tanks in this clip (scroll down to the bottom):

https://www.petshrimp.com/product/super ... algaeball/

Does the algae take well to beds/carpets?

[Rockhopper]

No, the macroalgae just grow in a clump that keeps getting bigger. If you want to separate it and attach it with fishing line or similar to rocks, you could do that for decoration purposes. As for carpets...the supershrimp mossballs do kinda form a carpet by filling up the entire bottom of a tank over time. Check out the video clip of one of my mossball tanks in this clip (scroll down to the bottom):

Oh man, that looks so good. I see you mention that your moss balls, like marimos, are slow growing. It must take an extremely long time to reach an inventory of that size, so I can understand the price. Approximately how long does it take a ball to grow to budding size?

On a side note, I received your macro algae shipment (a nice addition to the tank). I removed the nerite and java moss a week ago and cloudiness disappear the next day. It has been ~3 weeks since I started cycling and still no sign of algae. I'll be patient but when should I consider adding in bacteria?

Not sure if I mentioned this but I added a small 3 watt light soon after setting up the bowl.

[Rockhopper]

I've been waiting for signs of green algae before transferring the shrimp but I've notice small brown patches on the the rocks. Is this an indication that the bowl has cycled?

[Rockhopper]

Any insight on if this means my tank has cycled? I'm planning on moving them over this evening. Also is there a delicate way to transfer shrimp from one tank to another? I have a fine mesh net but am still worried their legs may get caught.

Thank you for any advice!