Oak leaves, super food or final alternative?

Ecir · Post by **Ecir** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:30 am

Lately there have been a lot of threads on leaf litter, particularly oak leaves. Who am I to swim against the current so I went out and got myself some leaves to experiment with.

Tank 1: Well established 10 gallon, lots of algae and surface area for bacteria. Huge colony of Cherries with a few Amano, Ghosts, Snails and Ottos. I only feed this tank occasionally as I enjoy watching the feeding frenzy.

Tank 2: Newly cycled 5 gallon tank, big plastic plant with some new algae growing on it. 10 Cherry shrimp and a couple of pond snails.

In Tank 1 I put in one oak leaf and over the past few weeks it's hardly been touched, In Tank 2 I put in 3 oak leaves and they're almost gone, pretty much skeletal remains of them. So are the shrimp I have picky eaters? You'd think with as many animals as I have in Tank 1 that one of them would have a taste for oak. I'll have to get some more leaves and experiment some more, but I find that given alternative sources they don't touch the oak leaf.

Ecir

badflash · Post by **badflash** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 10:42 am

The shrimp don't eat the oak leaves. They eat the bacteria and other micro-food that grows on it. It takes time for this stuff to build up.

Post by **Mustafa** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 11:30 am

Did you put *dry*, *brownish* oak leaves into your tank or fresh ones? It's highly unlikely that 10 shrimp can just take apart a whole oak leaf within just a few weeks. You might not have put an oak leaf in there but something that looked similar.

Badflash is right...the bacteria and other micro-organisms grow over time and are grazed upon by the shrimp as needed. So, you won't be seeing a ball of shrimp forming around the leaf.

wendyjo · Post by **wendyjo** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 4:16 pm

My guess would be the pond snails ate the leaves - they eat anything.

The Fisherman · Post by **The Fisherman** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 6:04 pm

Hmmm, interesting info guys. I was under the impression that the shrimp ate both micro organisms and the oak leaf itself. Thanks for the clarification.

Yep...Pond snails will eat almost anything. Mine ate cotton before... My bet would also be that the pond snails ate the leaves.

-John (AKA: The Puffer Ninja)

YuccaPatrol · Post by **YuccaPatrol** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:16 pm

In my magnolia leaf tank, the ramshorn snails eat the leaves themselves, but the shrimp pick at the micro-organisms.

As much as I believe that leaf litter is an important part of our efforts to duplicate natural conditions for dwarf shrimp, I also believe that there is still a need for some supplemental protein in the form of commercial foods.

Post by **Mustafa** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:41 pm

The Fisherman wrote:I was under the impression that the shrimp ate both micro organisms and the oak leaf itself.

They actually do eat some tiny amounts of leaf, too, but nothing noticable. It also depends on the shrimp species, some eat more of the leaf, some eat less.

Post by **Mustafa** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 7:43 pm

YuccaPatrol wrote: As much as I believe that leaf litter is an important part of our efforts to duplicate natural conditions for dwarf shrimp, I also believe that there is still a need for some supplemental protein in the form of commercial foods.

Yes, of course.

But very sparingly still, as always. No "I will leave a pellet there overnight" type of feeding.

The Fisherman · Post by **The Fisherman** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 8:25 pm

Mustafa wrote:
The Fisherman wrote:I was under the impression that the shrimp ate both micro organisms and the oak leaf itself.
They actually do eat some tiny amounts of leaf, too, but nothing noticable. It also depends on the shrimp species, some eat more of the leaf, some eat less.

Ah ok, good to know. Thanks again for the clarification.

-John (AKA: The Puffer Ninja)

Ecir · Post by **Ecir** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 9:24 pm

Ok, I just came home from work and it seems this has been a busy topic.

Let me clarify a bit:

The leaves I used WERE dry and brownish, I soaked them overnight before they went into the tank and if they weren't oak leaves then the oak tree I got them from is confused

.

The oak leaves have been in the tank for almost two weeks now, should be plenty of time for something to grow on them.

In the tank where the leaves are almost skeletal there are only 2 pond snails in with the 10 cherries, even if they were eating it that seems quite voracious.

In the tank where the leaf hasn't apparently been touched, there are at least a dozen pond snails, one apple snail, 3 ottos, 1 Ghost Shrimp, 5 Amano Shrimp a few generations of Cherries and one Bamboo. With a crowd like that you think the one leaf would disapear a lot faster then the three leaves in the small tank.

Ecir

Neonshrimp · Post by **Neonshrimp** » Sun Sep 17, 2006 11:05 pm

That is very interesting Eric. Please continue to update us on your further results. Maybe some shrimp just have bigger/better appetites than others. Hope you find out what causes this