My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

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Mech
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Mech »

Nexus6 wrote:
Mech wrote:I use one of those small filters attached to a pump and have it set very low, it barely moves the water just kicks out a few bubbles on the surface around the exit on the pump. so far so good .


Image

its pretty small.
Hi Mech, thats pretty neat, ive been wanting a small one, whats the size on that and where did you get it?

here is a similar one and they say these are the dimensions,

Specification:
Product dimension: 16.5L x 6W x 24.5Hcm Sponge dimension: 6D x 11.8Hcm
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aquarium-Bioc ... 51d4355d55

its probably the size of 2 palms put together, pretty common in shrimp tanks as the babys wont get sucked into the filter :)



edit: you can get single filter versions too.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Nexus6 »

Thanks Mech,

I was looking into getting that but a smaller version, i've seen the single ones too, but even those are kinda big. My tank is only 5gallons so I'm looking for something smaller preferrably a dual sponge one. Its too bad nobody makes a slim/nano version. I wouldnt know where to put that big thing:

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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by hardware_failure »

Im certainly not a seasoned opae ula vet yet but I have done a ton of back reading on this forum... I think you might be pleasantly surprised with how well you could get away with zero filtration, especially if you were to have some snails and a good balance of algae growth.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Nexus6 »

hardware_failure wrote:Im certainly not a seasoned opae ula vet yet but I have done a ton of back reading on this forum... I think you might be pleasantly surprised with how well you could get away with zero filtration, especially if you were to have some snails and a good balance of algae growth.
It looks like im going to have to just run the tank without any filtration. The sponges are way too big for my nano tank. And the small canister filter i have would produce too much water current.

On another note, Why is it so hard for me to grow algae? I dont see any algae growing and i have the light on 14+ hours. I wish i had the tank setup near sunlight. Does anyone know how to grow real live spirulina?
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by mcdaney »

On another note, Why is it so hard for me to grow algae? I dont see any algae growing and i have the light on 14+ hours. I wish i had the tank setup near sunlight. Does anyone know how to grow real live spirulina?
Hmm if there are animals in your tank, there should be algae growing at some point.
If you have another tank that's established you can take some (like less than a cup) of the water and pour it in your tank. :)
If you don't have an established tank, try throwing in a little food and some snails to kickstart the algae growing process. Ideally, this should be done during the cycling phase.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by JasonG3333 »

Nexus6 wrote: Theres probably no difference whether you use filters or without, etc. I might have to skip the canister filter altogether due to the water flow it creates. I just worry about ammonia buildup, especially when feeding them. Im at a loss at what to do, i want to take out that huge black HMF sponge filter ive got in the tank, but worry that by doing so, i will have taken out a heavy chunk of beneficial bacteria. Thus creating a mini cycle. I ordered a gallon of cultured water, so hopefully that will help. Ill update with pictures once i change things around.
Regarding your concern about ammonia if you don't implement some level of filtering - because Opae Ula are so small (this also goes for the small black snails that many of us include in our tanks), there will never be enough waste generated to crash the cycle. It's not like when a tank includes fish or even larger species of shrimp where there will be much more excrement (and therefore, ammonia) released into the water column making filtering absolutely necessary or else the tank will crash. Many folks who are new to keeping Opae Ula are so accustomed to the fact that filters, air pumps, heaters, etc are without question necessary for nearly every type of aquatic set-up that when they come across this particular animal, they just can't believe that you can sustain a healthy aquarium indefinitely (possibly forever) without any of that equipment and without ever doing water changes. Just top the water off whenever the water level drops an inch or two due to evaporation, and that's it. It is simply because these guys are so small that 1) there will never be enough ammonia generated to overwhelm the cycle, 2) there will always be enough oxygen for them without ever disturbing the surface of the water at all, and 3) they will always (or at least for a long time) have enough to eat without ever feeding them. I've been doing this for a couple of years now, and I have literally never fed them once. The reason I included "at least not for a long time" in there is because, if/when your tank ends up with so many shrimp (and I mean hundreds, even for relatively small tanks) that they (along with any snails) have eaten all the various growths in there (algae, cyanobacteria, dinoflagellates, etc - it's all edible to them), only then you might have to drop an algae wafer (or whatever) in there every week or two. But it could be years before your tank, or any newer tank, gets to the point where any additional food is necessary. If you still feel you need or simply prefer to implement a filter, something that moves the water as little as possible is definitely best (as you know), and it sounds like the pump you're considering, on the lowest setting, will be fine (but again, not at all necessary, especially if you never feed them, which again, you don't need to).

So, no need to be at loss with all this - just keep it simple - no filter, no food. Also, be careful with adding any type of "special" water such as the cultured water you mentioned or products such as that instant-cycle water. Those types of things can sometimes lead to an over-abundance of cyanobacteria, dinoflagellates, or other growths of the like. If that were to happen, it won't hurt the shrimp (as mentioned), but it just doesn't look that nice in there. Ideally, you just want a thin layer of nice green algae on everything, which is more likely to happen if nothing special is done to the water, and if you do not feed. You just need to let the plain ol' untouched RO or distilled water naturally cycle (if it hasn't already), and you're done - nothing else to do or worry about. In my very first tank, which I set-up without first coming across the info on this website/forum, I used that CaribSea instant-cycle water, and I put an algae wafer in there for a bit on the first day I added the shrimp, and it lead to a lot of aesthetically undesirable growth, as you can see here: viewtopic.php?f=16&t=5199 (gotta scroll down for the pictures which I had to re-upload to the post).

If you haven't already, read through all this Opae Ula info and tank setup instructions that Mustafa has included on this site: http://www.petshrimp.com/hawaiianredshrimp.php. Very informative, and based on my and many others' experiences, very accurate.

Hope that helps some with the decisions you're mulling over! I'll look out for the photos of what you end up doing!
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by JasonG3333 »

mcdaney wrote:
On another note, Why is it so hard for me to grow algae? I dont see any algae growing and i have the light on 14+ hours. I wish i had the tank setup near sunlight. Does anyone know how to grow real live spirulina?
Hmm if there are animals in your tank, there should be algae growing at some point.
If you have another tank that's established you can take some (like less than a cup) of the water and pour it in your tank. :)
If you don't have an established tank, try throwing in a little food and some snails to kickstart the algae growing process. Ideally, this should be done during the cycling phase.
I highly recommend getting some that macroalgae (spaghetti algae) sold on this site. Definitely helps kickstart the algae growth big time, at least in my experience. And you'll get some of Mustafa's tank water into your tank. And, like any live greenery in an aquarium, it will also contribute to the oxygenation of the tank (dissolved oxygen), for those of you out there worried about not using an air pump or some sort of water surface disturber.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Mech »

Nexus6 wrote:On another note, Why is it so hard for me to grow algae? I dont see any algae growing and i have the light on 14+ hours. I wish i had the tank setup near sunlight. Does anyone know how to grow real live spirulina?


i think your prodibio biodigest supplement may be delaying the growth of your algae.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Nexus6 »

Jason, thanks for your reply, very useful. The water i got was cultured water from a long established opae tank. The coral rocks i ordered also, from the same tank which was supposed to have lots of green algae on it, when the rocks arrived from hawaii, i was disappointed to see that it wasnt as green as i had hoped for (or was as shown in the picture). Anyways, i was hoping this bit of algae and the cultured water would help stabilize my tank, but i dont think it did much, because i am showing about .15ppm ammonia levels, which im trying to keep at bay with prime. (nitrite and nitrate both show 0, Ph 8.0)

Should i wait till ammonia levels drop naturally? Or do a water change and not feed the opaes at all for a few weeks to a month. I think my ammonia levels went up a bit due to overfeeding. I was worried that there was nothing for them to eat since i dont see any algae growth, and afterall i do have around 70 opaes in a 5g tank.

I feel like my tank was not as fully cycled as i had originally thought. I knew i should of started with fish food or ammonia :smt021

As far as diatoms, dinoflagellates, cyanobacteria, or any other growth or algae go, i see absolutly no sign of any of that. Ive got lighting on all day too. Like 15 hours a day.

I decided not to go with any kind of filtration, but have you noticed that the opaes poop A LOT? At least mine do.

I was thinking about getting mustafas spaghetti algae, but it looks so messy in the tank, for oxygen ive got a small fan that disturbs the water so that should be enough.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Nexus6 »

Mech wrote:
Nexus6 wrote:On another note, Why is it so hard for me to grow algae? I dont see any algae growing and i have the light on 14+ hours. I wish i had the tank setup near sunlight. Does anyone know how to grow real live spirulina?
i think your prodibio biodigest supplement may be delaying the growth of your algae.
Perhaps, do you think this is so because the algae is fighting the bacteria for nutrients?
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by hardware_failure »

They do seem to poop alot, but its super tiny poop.

The fan is totally unnecessary for gas exchange. Remember these shrimp (arguably) "survive" in ecospheres.

Since the bio load is so small from the shrimp, I suspect that is why we often see slow or little algae growth.

"A watch pot never boils"

Just leave things alone and give it time :)
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Mustafa »

You do realize that *none* of the videos and places you mentioned below are actually from breeders, right? Especially the first one that actually sells these shrimp lives right next to protected habitats on the big island of Hawaii and just goes out there and catches wild shrimp to sell. The shrimp you see in those tanks are all wild caught. Most directly wild caught shrimp are very red (probably due to diet) at first...but that intense red goes away after a few months and is replaced by the "normal" intensity of reds seen in captive-bred shrimp.

I'm really the *only* breeder out who breeds commercial quantities of Supershrimp every month (i.e. thousands) and offers them for sale. There is only one other person I am aware of who actually breeds and sells these shrimp...but he has only a few tanks. None of us live on Hawaii. Anyone living on Hawaii and *claiming* to breed these shrimp is not telling the truth unfortunately. So, whatever you see out there on youtube from such people are just a bunch of wild-caught (mostly illegally...also mostly illegally sold without a license...but unfortunately Hawaii isn't doing much about it) shrimp in holding tanks. If they have filters or not is irrelevant to their coloration or well-being. I wouldn't pay attention at all to what those websites and videos are recommending. They sell wild-caught shrimp and have no breeding experience...period.

All my tanks (with all 150,000+ shrimp) lack filters or any water movement. That has proven to be the best way of keeping and breeding these shrimp. You can, of course, continue using a filter but don't think that it's going to improve anything...and you may in fact not see reproduction due to it. With minimal flow you may get away with it...but I still don't see the sense in it. What is the filter supposed to do that isn't already happening in a filterless tank?

So...no..there is really no debate. If there were...I would know about it because I'd be one of the participants in the debate. There is only the method that has been proven to work (the "Petshrimp Method") and then there are a bunch of people still not believing that filters are unnecessary and undesirable....despite all the evidence of various people keeping and breeding these shrimp here and elsewhere. :-D
Nexus6 wrote:
Hi jason, thanks for your input. This has been a long going debate i think. Yes, the overall concensus is that opaes prefer completely still water and can survive in any conditions witout any filtration nedded, but i tend to rely on what successful breeders do, since breeding is difficult to perfect. Check out what shrimpmart does: http://youtu.be/K_arDfD3zDs

Hes got a lot of foam and a huge HOB filtration unit and as you can see from the numerous healthy red opaes, i think hes got a great setup, its not a show tank, but i would want healthy happy opaes like his.

There are a few other videos ive seen where they've used either a air bubbler foam filter or a undergravel filter with GREAT success. One tank had literally thousands of them.

I was originally going to keep them in the tank without a filter, but after seeing these tanks i think its okay to use a filtration system with minimal flow, although through my own observation the opaes DO prefer still waters, if you see videos of them in their natural anchialine pool habitats, the water does seem pretty still as well. Im sure theyll do great without any filtration as well.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Nexus6 »

Ya thats why i decided to go with no filtration or any water flow as per your suggestion and they seem to be doing great. The shrimp i got were from a local non wild caught breeder in texas.
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Re: My Opae Ula Tank Introduction

Post by Mustafa »

Nexus6 wrote:Ya thats why i decided to go with no filtration or any water flow as per your suggestion and they seem to be doing great. The shrimp i got were from a local non wild caught breeder in texas.

Ahhh...ok. Awesome! :)
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