New journey and questions
Moderator: Mustafa
New journey and questions
Hello Everyone,
Sorry for the long post.
I started a small tank (0.5 gal or less) two years ago with 10 shrimps, can’t really remember how many problems I ran into along the way but with the help from people and Mustafa of this site I managed to pull through every time. The tank finally settled and the shrimps lived happily ever after. Then I was leaving them alone, letting them thrive and not paying attention to them anymore for a long time, until recently when I discovered that one of the shrimps was pregnant. I was super excited and it reignited my passion about the shrimps again.
So long story short, I decided to start a new tank, way way bigger this time, a 10 gallon tank. I was thinking about tanks with hundreds of shrimps like those from Mustafa's breeding lab. With all the initial set ups done, once again I run into unexpected problems that I couldn’t figure out myself. I am listing them down and posting some pictures. I will try to be as detail as possible, please help me, thank you very much in advance. I really love the shrimps and to see even one die breaks my heart.
Detail information about the tank:
I understand that adding too many fancy stuff in the beginning increase chances to mess up things real bad, so I decorate the tank only with porous volcanic rocks, and aquarium soil, the type I see a lot of people use here, and super moss ball purchased from this site two years ago for my smaller tank.
All water used is bottled distilled water and salinity is calibrated to 1.012 with marine salt. I set up the smaller tank the same way two years ago.
Ammonia 0, NO3 NO2 both 0, pH 6.3 (all parameters are same as smaller tanks except the pH value, my smaller one reads 7.5+ and new one shows 6.3-, also sometimes I really wish someone could quantify the water quality, like a list of all required parameters you need to be aware, go ahead and make your own water parameters within accepted ranges from the list and you are all set, success guaranteed:))
I live in Hong Kong, the temperature recently is around 30 degrees celcius. The tank is by the window on the 7th floor, it has direct and adequate sunlight (when it's too strong I close curtains), I also have a 7 watt light bulb from IKEA in reserve for cloudy or rainy weather, or observation purposes.
Tank cycled for exactly two months, substrates and rocks rinsed prior to set up. Snails were put inside mid way during that period. Water is crystal clear, no smell. I do replace water from time to time to remove the biofilm floating on the surface when it gets too thick, and it get thick fairly quickly.
Problems with my tank:
1. No visible algae. I let the tank sit by the window with ample sunlight to cycle for nearly two months before I introduce shrimps into it, hoping to see green algae covering rocks and substrates. But nothing happens the entire time, all rocks and substrate remained same as they were two months ago. The water is clear and there is brownish thing growing on the glass (not the green algae I want), and some biofilm on the water surface. I introduced two snails to to deal with the brownish thing and they did a good job containing its growth. Is it possible that algae spores are rare in Hong Kong due to the climate? Because it took the smaller tank long long time to finally see some green.
2. Mustafa Super mossball turning brown. I thought not seeing visible algae doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't anything going on down there, after all it took my small tank at least 20 months to see something green grow. So I assumed that the cycling is near completion and went ahead and took the super moss ball from my smaller tank to the new one in hope to speed things up. And instead of that, the one hardy strong super mossball turned brown itself. I am really at a loss here since this mossball is supposed to be incredibly adaptive to any environment, does turning brown means it is dying?
3. Shrimps not moving and are extremely shy of light. Since I live in Hong Kong and there is no way for me to get shrimps from this site, I took the more expensive way to order shrimps from the only local vendor at around 8 USD a piece for 10 pieces. (I was thinking to use them as scouts, if they did OK I will introduce a hundred more, and I really didn't wanna use shrimps from my smaller tank, because they have suffered enough before and have earned their places there). I realized their can be something wrong with the water so I tested it, Ammonia 0, pH 6.3, salinity 1.012, it seemed OK but to be on the safe side I still had a 90% water change before putting the shrimps in. I slowly and carefully mixed tank water with water that the shrimps came in with, to let them have a smooth transition. Shrimps seemed to be doing OK initially but after a few hours they stopped being active, and preferred to stay very still where they are, for hours they didn't move at all, and then overnight they all hid behind the rocks, away from any light source. it's been four days now and they are still hiding, none of them was visible during day time, none doing any type of foraging and swimming like those in my smaller tanks. On rare occasions you can see one or two going out but on the first sight of light they retreated back to under the rocks. This behavior is not observed in my smaller tank at all. Although no shrimps died as of this moment I fear it was just a matter of time. It just felt they are sick and not happy, because they are not showing that burning red color, most of them stayed transparent and their spines turned white, a sign that they are stressed a lot.
4.pH value not ideal. I understand shrimps like water with higher pH value, preferably 7-8, but my water stays at 6.3-. I’m not sure if that’s the cause for everything but it is a possibility. I also noticed that most people from this forum get naturally 7+. So what did I do wrong or what can I do to improve the pH value consistently and harmlessly?
In the attachment one is my established small tank and others are from the bigger one, you can clearly see the brown mossball. Tank looks empty but there are 10 shrimps in there.
My other 100 shrimps is on the way here and I need to know urgently what went wrong here before they arrive, anyone can help me please? if you need information, ask your questions and I will be providing as soon as possible.
Updates:
My 100 shrimps have arrived, 4 died on the way. I put the rest in the tank, they seem active in big numbers, but still 5 died over a period of 48 hours. I'm not sure if this is an acceptable death ratio, I really hope the rest is doing OK. I'm a little scared.
Sorry for the long post.
I started a small tank (0.5 gal or less) two years ago with 10 shrimps, can’t really remember how many problems I ran into along the way but with the help from people and Mustafa of this site I managed to pull through every time. The tank finally settled and the shrimps lived happily ever after. Then I was leaving them alone, letting them thrive and not paying attention to them anymore for a long time, until recently when I discovered that one of the shrimps was pregnant. I was super excited and it reignited my passion about the shrimps again.
So long story short, I decided to start a new tank, way way bigger this time, a 10 gallon tank. I was thinking about tanks with hundreds of shrimps like those from Mustafa's breeding lab. With all the initial set ups done, once again I run into unexpected problems that I couldn’t figure out myself. I am listing them down and posting some pictures. I will try to be as detail as possible, please help me, thank you very much in advance. I really love the shrimps and to see even one die breaks my heart.
Detail information about the tank:
I understand that adding too many fancy stuff in the beginning increase chances to mess up things real bad, so I decorate the tank only with porous volcanic rocks, and aquarium soil, the type I see a lot of people use here, and super moss ball purchased from this site two years ago for my smaller tank.
All water used is bottled distilled water and salinity is calibrated to 1.012 with marine salt. I set up the smaller tank the same way two years ago.
Ammonia 0, NO3 NO2 both 0, pH 6.3 (all parameters are same as smaller tanks except the pH value, my smaller one reads 7.5+ and new one shows 6.3-, also sometimes I really wish someone could quantify the water quality, like a list of all required parameters you need to be aware, go ahead and make your own water parameters within accepted ranges from the list and you are all set, success guaranteed:))
I live in Hong Kong, the temperature recently is around 30 degrees celcius. The tank is by the window on the 7th floor, it has direct and adequate sunlight (when it's too strong I close curtains), I also have a 7 watt light bulb from IKEA in reserve for cloudy or rainy weather, or observation purposes.
Tank cycled for exactly two months, substrates and rocks rinsed prior to set up. Snails were put inside mid way during that period. Water is crystal clear, no smell. I do replace water from time to time to remove the biofilm floating on the surface when it gets too thick, and it get thick fairly quickly.
Problems with my tank:
1. No visible algae. I let the tank sit by the window with ample sunlight to cycle for nearly two months before I introduce shrimps into it, hoping to see green algae covering rocks and substrates. But nothing happens the entire time, all rocks and substrate remained same as they were two months ago. The water is clear and there is brownish thing growing on the glass (not the green algae I want), and some biofilm on the water surface. I introduced two snails to to deal with the brownish thing and they did a good job containing its growth. Is it possible that algae spores are rare in Hong Kong due to the climate? Because it took the smaller tank long long time to finally see some green.
2. Mustafa Super mossball turning brown. I thought not seeing visible algae doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't anything going on down there, after all it took my small tank at least 20 months to see something green grow. So I assumed that the cycling is near completion and went ahead and took the super moss ball from my smaller tank to the new one in hope to speed things up. And instead of that, the one hardy strong super mossball turned brown itself. I am really at a loss here since this mossball is supposed to be incredibly adaptive to any environment, does turning brown means it is dying?
3. Shrimps not moving and are extremely shy of light. Since I live in Hong Kong and there is no way for me to get shrimps from this site, I took the more expensive way to order shrimps from the only local vendor at around 8 USD a piece for 10 pieces. (I was thinking to use them as scouts, if they did OK I will introduce a hundred more, and I really didn't wanna use shrimps from my smaller tank, because they have suffered enough before and have earned their places there). I realized their can be something wrong with the water so I tested it, Ammonia 0, pH 6.3, salinity 1.012, it seemed OK but to be on the safe side I still had a 90% water change before putting the shrimps in. I slowly and carefully mixed tank water with water that the shrimps came in with, to let them have a smooth transition. Shrimps seemed to be doing OK initially but after a few hours they stopped being active, and preferred to stay very still where they are, for hours they didn't move at all, and then overnight they all hid behind the rocks, away from any light source. it's been four days now and they are still hiding, none of them was visible during day time, none doing any type of foraging and swimming like those in my smaller tanks. On rare occasions you can see one or two going out but on the first sight of light they retreated back to under the rocks. This behavior is not observed in my smaller tank at all. Although no shrimps died as of this moment I fear it was just a matter of time. It just felt they are sick and not happy, because they are not showing that burning red color, most of them stayed transparent and their spines turned white, a sign that they are stressed a lot.
4.pH value not ideal. I understand shrimps like water with higher pH value, preferably 7-8, but my water stays at 6.3-. I’m not sure if that’s the cause for everything but it is a possibility. I also noticed that most people from this forum get naturally 7+. So what did I do wrong or what can I do to improve the pH value consistently and harmlessly?
In the attachment one is my established small tank and others are from the bigger one, you can clearly see the brown mossball. Tank looks empty but there are 10 shrimps in there.
My other 100 shrimps is on the way here and I need to know urgently what went wrong here before they arrive, anyone can help me please? if you need information, ask your questions and I will be providing as soon as possible.
Updates:
My 100 shrimps have arrived, 4 died on the way. I put the rest in the tank, they seem active in big numbers, but still 5 died over a period of 48 hours. I'm not sure if this is an acceptable death ratio, I really hope the rest is doing OK. I'm a little scared.
Last edited by kyle0901 on Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:22 am, edited 17 times in total.
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- Shrimpoholic
- Posts: 363
- Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:20 pm
- Location: Southern California, USA
Re: New Journey and questions
The brown stuff looks like diatoms to me, and the shrimp like it. They may be hiding and not moving because there is so much food in the tank from the diatoms. Is the tank covered? I don't think anything is necessarily wrong, just there are very few shrimp in proportion to the number of hiding places and the diatoms on all the surfaces have created a massive amount of available food, so they don't really need to forage. When you see a shrimp, is its gut full?
Edited to add: The diatoms will disappear on their own, or when the army of 100 opae arrive
Edited to add: The diatoms will disappear on their own, or when the army of 100 opae arrive
Re: New Journey and questions
Thank you Jess, These shrimps are way too inactive to be normal. When my shrimps in smaller tanks are well fed(I assume), they still swim and play around, they would never stay in one place for more than five minutes.
I can't really see clearly if they are fed or not, in fact I can barely see them at all, and even when I do I don't know the difference between a full and empty belly. The tank has a cover, I leave it open for air exchange during daytime and only close it at night to prevent snails from walking out or any bugs getting in. The cover is not airtight anyway it does allow air to flow freely.
Also do you have any clue as to the reason the mossball turning brown? Thank you again.
I can't really see clearly if they are fed or not, in fact I can barely see them at all, and even when I do I don't know the difference between a full and empty belly. The tank has a cover, I leave it open for air exchange during daytime and only close it at night to prevent snails from walking out or any bugs getting in. The cover is not airtight anyway it does allow air to flow freely.
Also do you have any clue as to the reason the mossball turning brown? Thank you again.
Re: New journey and questions
I suggest making a mound from the lava rocks to provide necessary hiding places. And stop worrying and do not feed anything.
Re: New journey and questions
thanks for the advice, I might do that in the future but right now I’m actually worried that they are hiding too much lol
Re: New journey and questions
With only a small group of 10 in a 10 gallon tank if given the opportunity to hide they will from time to time.You cannot always expect your plants to flourish when there's nothing in there for it to feed on? The tanks or jars for opae are simple. Some for of substrate, rocks, water, & algae. My idea temp would be 70 but that's not always possible.So they fluctuate from 65-70 in the winter and 74-80 degrees in the summer depending on whether or not I use my chillers on the tanks. You might want to consider feeding just a bit of freeze dried spirulina just to just start the cycle in your tank and you'll need it to support the additional 100 coming in. You can also add some of your established water from your .5. As slightly as the film on the water is it's full of nutrients. By adding tank water from one to another I was able to get both brown & green algae going in 2 weeks in a 10 gallon tank.
Re: New journey and questions
Thanks, I did mix water from old tank to try to introduce some beneficial content, but the old one is too small compared to the new tank, any water from it seems insignificant, I have no idea if this will work but I did it a few times. I even took some pebbles covered with algae from old tank to add to the new, but the algae also don’t seem to spread at all. It felt like everything except the brown algae is not growing.
Re: New journey and questions
Brown algae is good. You just don't have much in there to support it so it will take time.
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- Shrimpoholic
- Posts: 363
- Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 2:20 pm
- Location: Southern California, USA
Re: New journey and questions
Brown algae usually makes its appearance before green algae. I think if your shrimp want to hide you should let them. It will make them happy, and you'll be able to see more when your 100 shrimp come.
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- Tiny Shrimp
- Posts: 95
- Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:27 am
Re: New journey and questions
Your on track it just takes a long time to really get things going make sure you have your light on for at least 1/2 the day and introduce indirected lighting.
Re: New journey and questions
It may be too late to change things, but I have to ask just what the "aquarium soil" you used is? These guys typically do best with inert sand or rock, those shrimp "soils" (if this is one) to my knowledge are made for freshwater shrimp and may do unwanted things to water intended for supershrimp. I'm not sure though, but hopefully someone can clarify. I may be way off here.
Re: New journey and questions
I was thinking the same thing about the soil. I'm wondering if it's used for planted tanks.
I used aragonite and lava rocks in my 10 gal. I don't know what my parameters were because I didn't test anything. I had a starter gallon of water and aragonite that had algae growing in it. (I was waiting for the current tank occupant to die.) I dumped that in. I mixed up the rest of the water, waited a few days (maybe 3-5), and dumped in the shrimp.
Re: New journey and questions
thank you for the replies guys. Yes this is soil for aquarium plants, but I have seen quite many people using this type of soil for their tanks here and there in this forum, so I figured it is OK anyway. And even if I want to replace it with sands it is too late now. My 100 shrimp army has arrived and settled. After 14 days 11 have died due to all sorts of unknown reasons. Rest stabilized and thrived for now. I think a substrate replacement now is theoretically possible but too risk At this moment lol. So far all seems OK except that the pH is still below 7. I fed them with some spirulina flakes. No more deaths occurs for a week.
Re: New journey and questions
..kyle0901 wrote: ↑Tue Jun 30, 2020 7:10 am thank you for the replies guys. Yes this is soil for aquarium plants, but I have seen quite many people using this type of soil for their tanks here and there in this forum, so I figured it is OK anyway. And even if I want to replace it with sands it is too late now. My 100 shrimp army has arrived and settled. After 14 days 11 have died due to all sorts of unknown reasons. Rest stabilized and thrived for now. I think a substrate replacement now is theoretically possible but too risk At this moment lol. So far all seems OK except that the pH is still below 7. I fed them with some spirulina flakes. No more deaths occurs for a week.
The substrate is likely the cause of the deaths. pH below 7 is way too low, it needs to be 8-8.5.
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Re: New journey and questions
I'm curious just where on this forum you've seen tanks using aquarium soil for supershrimp? I certainly can't recall any.
These shrimp are tough and adaptable so I hope it works out. I do wish I had seen your topic sooner though, we might have avoided all of this.