Problem with "combat cancers", HELP!!

[Daniel G]

I have recently seen a virtual explosion of a small crustacean in my shrimp tanks and I had trouble understanding what species it was. I now realize it is Hyalella azteca.

I have tried removing visible animals but it seems impossible to get them all out! According to species informaion on the web they rarely eat anything but microscopic plancton and decaying plantmatter (and an occasional shrimplet?) but they are not very estethicly pleasing in the tanks and I need tips on how to get rid of them. They mus have come with the original shrimp I bought from a breeder in Germany because I have a memory of seeing one or two of them when I initally started the tanks... only whish I had removed them when they where in the plastic bags.... I have read that they thrive in Riccia so I suppose they would have shown up eventually anyway, since I have bought Riccia from various sources.

Anyone else have this problem?

Daniel

[badflash]

I actually bought some of these to keep my tanks clean. They do a good job of that, but "pretty" isn't something I worry about. I just like cool animals. When I got a load of Ill-fated shrimp from AZgardens, I got several freebie scuds in the batch. I didn't mind. They live down in the gravel and eat what nobady else wants. I rarely see them. Same goes for my planaria. Neat animals, they eat garbage and don't seem to hurt anything.

I can't see any easy way to get rid of them other than removal of your shrimp and bombing the tank. Anything that eats them will eat the shrimp first, anything that will make them sick will kill the shrimp first. Learn to love them. Study their mating habits. They are as strange as the scuds.

[Daniel G]

The thing is that they seem to bother the shrimps, they are walking all over them. Also I´m worried that they might eat the shrimplets.

Do you think they come from overfeeding? Their numbers will probably reduce with less food in the tank but the shrimps will not get anything to eat either....

I´m thinking about removing the older shrimps, carefully avoiding the scuds and then cranking up the temperature to 33-35 Celsius. I read that they die from temps over 33 degrees?

Daniel

[edinjapan]

The thing is that they seem to bother the shrimps, they are walking all over them. Also I´m worried that they might eat the shrimplets.

Do you think they come from overfeeding? Their numbers will probably reduce with less food in the tank but the shrimps will not get anything to eat either....

I´m thinking about removing the older shrimps, carefully avoiding the scuds and then cranking up the temperature to 33-35 Celsius. I read that they die from temps over 33 degrees?

Daniel

I'd like to get some of these. They'd make a great 'addition' to my wild bettas' diets. These guys would take great pleasure in hunting them down and playing with them just like they do with the sacrificial shrimp I toss them from time to time.

[Mustafa]

The thing is that they seem to bother the shrimps, they are walking all over them. Also I´m worried that they might eat the shrimplets.

Do you think they come from overfeeding? Their numbers will probably reduce with less food in the tank but the shrimps will not get anything to eat either....

I´m thinking about removing the older shrimps, carefully avoiding the scuds and then cranking up the temperature to 33-35 Celsius. I read that they die from temps over 33 degrees?

Daniel

Hi Daniel,

You are right, they bother the shrimp when they occur in great numbers. Female shrimp can even drop eggs if there are hundreds of scuds in the tank. I have just recently had this problem and removed my whole shrimp population from that tank after unsuccessfully trying to catch all of the scuds over several weeks. I must have caught several hundred scuds out of that tank. It's not just that they can bother the shrimp (although they definitely do not eat the young) but they eat any plant they can find if they occur in such large numbers.

It is almost impossible to get rid of them. I originally put them in one of my shrimp tanks on purpose...about 7-8 of them. After a while they multiplied and there were hundreds. Then, I bought two South American Freshwaters puffers, removed my shrimp from that tank and put the puffers in there. Right away they started hunting down the shrimp and by the end of the day I had two very round/fat puffers and no visible scuds in the tank. The puffers were in that tank for a few months. During that time I did not see a single scud. Then I sold the puffers because I needed that tank for shrimp again. A few days after I started seeing scuds again! They had dug themselves into my sand substrate and had been waiting patiently for the puffers to disappear! They had probably been nocturnal all this time, only coming out of the sand when the puffers were sleeping.

To make a long story short, the were hundreds of them again within a few weeks. So, now all the shrimp have been romoved from that tank and I put some Macrobrachium sp. in there. My Macrobrachiums have reduced the number the scuds tremendously and I only see a few once in a while. The good thing about using Macrobrachiums for scud contro/elimination is that they do not sleep. They hunt day and night so there is no resting period for the scuds.

In any case, good luck with your scud problem! I'm not sure the temperature-increase method works, though since I have had over 33 degrees celsius in that tank over the summer and the scuds were still happily reproducing.

[badflash]

Once you remove the shrimp you could try spiking the pH to 12 or 13 for a day or two, then you can neutralize back to normal. That sort of pH will digest them.

[Daniel G]

Thanks for the tip. have you tried this yourself? And how would you go about creating such a high Ph?

It only takes two srviviors to create a new plague....


Daniel

[badflash]

No, I have not tried this for scuds, but it should wipe out most anything that lives without effecting the sand. Plants would probably have a problem.

I would use standard sodium hydroxide (Lye). It can be neutralized with Muratic Acid. Don't go overboard and be careful. This stuff can hurt you if you get it on you.

No long term toxicity as the reaction of sodium hydroxide with HCl is salty water. A few water changes should fix it.

[Daniel G]

I have now tried using Sera Snecktol with Cupric Sulfate as the active engredience to fight the scuds. A normal dose had no effect whatsoever, but a double dose killed off about 99% of them.

I had removed all the shrimps from the tank but accidentally forgot two bumblebee shrimp. They survived the double dose Snecktol so I am now in doubt concerning the shrimps sensistivity to Copper!

Since there were still live scuds in the tank I lost my temper and emptied the whole bottle of Snecktol in the tank ( resulting in aprox. a quadrupel dose). This killed one of the shrimps but had no effect on the remaining scuds, the remaining scuds must be totaly resistent to Cupric Sulfate.

The surviving bumblebee was evacuated to another tank and I went about lowering the Ph in the tank to give the scuds a Ph-shock! With a Ph-test and some Fosforic acid I lowered the Ph fom about 8 to 4,5 in 15 minutes. I could literaly see them dying in front of my eyes. Cruel? maybe, but now I was feeling realy desperate.

I guess I have to wait a week or two to make sure that no scuds appear again before starting up the tank with shrimps again....

Daniel

[TKD]

I have now tried using Sera Snecktol with Cupric Sulfate as the active engredience to fight the scuds. A normal dose had no effect whatsoever, but a double dose killed off about 99% of them.

I had removed all the shrimps from the tank but accidentally forgot two bumblebee shrimp. They survived the double dose Snecktol so I am now in doubt concerning the shrimps sensistivity to Copper!

Since there were still live scuds in the tank I lost my temper and emptied the whole bottle of Snecktol in the tank ( resulting in aprox. a quadrupel dose). This killed one of the shrimps but had no effect on the remaining scuds, the remaining scuds must be totaly resistent to Cupric Sulfate.

The surviving bumblebee was evacuated to another tank and I went about lowering the Ph in the tank to give the scuds a Ph-shock! With a Ph-test and some Fosforic acid I lowered the Ph fom about 8 to 4,5 in 15 minutes. I could literaly see them dying in front of my eyes. Cruel? maybe, but now I was feeling realy desperate.

I guess I have to wait a week or two to make sure that no scuds appear again before starting up the tank with shrimps again....

Daniel

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think I would want you near my tanks....

TKD

[Killfrenzy]

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think I would want you near my tanks....

TKD

Agreement.

[edinjapan]

Maybe it's just me, but I don't think I would want you near my tanks....

TKD

Agreement.

Overkill... The guy was desperate. I would have thrown in a crew of hungry kribs, Betta pugnax or some loaches to eradicate these little monsters.

Chemical warfare is a last resort. He did sound desperate.